Had another slow pick at the flounder from all my old hot spots from around massepequa cove to sqwaw island to short beach.Could there be any possibility the comeback the bass have made,possibly feeding on one of there favorite snacks.thanx for any thoughts on where the flounder are. Dannyboy
where the flounder are
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Hello Dannyboy,
I certainly hope you don't mean the NY Massapequa cove... because the NY's flounder fishery is closed from September 15 to November 30th.
Or - Are you reffering to NJ waters?
"Crazy" Alberto
[email protected]
I certainly hope you don't mean the NY Massapequa cove... because the NY's flounder fishery is closed from September 15 to November 30th.
Or - Are you reffering to NJ waters?
"Crazy" Alberto
[email protected]
Joined
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1,006 Posts
Dannyboy;
Good news for you from Bill at Comb's, one of the eel guys that uses underwater lights for jacking saw little flounder by the thousands around State Channel on every drop. It will take a couple of seasons for them to grow but looks good.
P.S., they are closed until spring and you will be fined if you're caught fishing for them now.
Bill Sullivan
Jones/Debs editor
Nor'east Saltwater
Good news for you from Bill at Comb's, one of the eel guys that uses underwater lights for jacking saw little flounder by the thousands around State Channel on every drop. It will take a couple of seasons for them to grow but looks good.
P.S., they are closed until spring and you will be fined if you're caught fishing for them now.
Bill Sullivan
Jones/Debs editor
Nor'east Saltwater
why is everyone who replied to my original question keep talking to me like i am fishing for flounder out of season or doing anything unethical when it comes to nature or rules and regs.I have found some of these answers are way off base.I dont know if i worded things poorly to begin with but i was just asking what the reasons could be for the flounder dropoff in recent years. But i only meant for during the season not now.Have a happy holiday to all.
dannyboy,
don't take it personally. some people just don't read things very carefully. sometimes, people are too quick to put other people down; usually, when they don't understand themselves. maybe it makes them feel better or more important. anyway,it is their problem and not yours. there are many people who will take the time to consider your posts, so don't be discouraged.
i understood your question, and i thought it was a legitimate and thoughtful question. i will try to address it.
stripers are important predators of flounder.
i very often find fall stripers with several young of the year (3"-4") flounder in their stomachs.
that said, i do not think stripers are the main cause for the low numbers of flounders. after all, in the past we have seen populations of both species at high numbers, at the same time.
i think that it is fishing pressure (commercial and recreational) that is the most likely cause for the low numbers of flounders.
also, since flounder spawn in the bays in late winter/early spring and then grow from there inside the bays, pollution and destruction of wetlands may also be factors contributing to their decline.
set,
opinari
don't take it personally. some people just don't read things very carefully. sometimes, people are too quick to put other people down; usually, when they don't understand themselves. maybe it makes them feel better or more important. anyway,it is their problem and not yours. there are many people who will take the time to consider your posts, so don't be discouraged.
i understood your question, and i thought it was a legitimate and thoughtful question. i will try to address it.
stripers are important predators of flounder.
i very often find fall stripers with several young of the year (3"-4") flounder in their stomachs.
that said, i do not think stripers are the main cause for the low numbers of flounders. after all, in the past we have seen populations of both species at high numbers, at the same time.
i think that it is fishing pressure (commercial and recreational) that is the most likely cause for the low numbers of flounders.
also, since flounder spawn in the bays in late winter/early spring and then grow from there inside the bays, pollution and destruction of wetlands may also be factors contributing to their decline.
set,
opinari
Hi,
Have watched the comorants for several years. They are very good fishermen. And I am sure the seals are even better at it.
Sure they are responsible for deleteing the stocks somewhat.
Have you ever noticed how many 2" fluke and flounder are in the bellies of the fluke we catch?? Every summer in Shinne**** I see the fluke spitting out these baby fish.
I think the lack of fall flounder is partially due to the water temps in the bay not falling soon enough. The flounders stay off shore in cooler water.
Anyone who has kept a daily water temp log on any bay will verify this.
Capt Neil
Custom Fishing Rods by Captain Neil
(631)567-8049
Have watched the comorants for several years. They are very good fishermen. And I am sure the seals are even better at it.
Sure they are responsible for deleteing the stocks somewhat.
Have you ever noticed how many 2" fluke and flounder are in the bellies of the fluke we catch?? Every summer in Shinne**** I see the fluke spitting out these baby fish.
I think the lack of fall flounder is partially due to the water temps in the bay not falling soon enough. The flounders stay off shore in cooler water.
Anyone who has kept a daily water temp log on any bay will verify this.
Capt Neil
Custom Fishing Rods by Captain Neil
(631)567-8049
Mea Culpa
I'm one of those people who assumed you were targetting Flounder out of season.
It just seemed you were talking about fishing for them in Massapequa Cove CURRENTLY. It was only AFTER you said "why are these people telling me about the season?" that I went back and re-read your original post. The word "TODAY" was not in it (as you know) but it SEEMED that way the first time around. Sorry.
To answer your question, no, I don't think Stripers are responsible for the shortage of Flounder. In the glory days, when you could fill a bushel with flounder on any outing, the Bass were more numerous than now. I don't believe it's the Seals or the Cormorants either. No predator is responsible, and that includes man. Welll maybe man is a little responsible...let me explain.
Vacuum dredging kills thousands of immature Flounder daily. Heavy metals on the bottom make many historical spawning sites toxic. I've seen thousands of dead, immature Flounder no bigger than your thumbnail in both Manhasset and Little Neck Bays. Even (gasp) commercial fishermen cannot compare to the losses due to habitat degradation. There is no relief in sight.
The diver who saw Flounder on every drop in the State Boat Channel sure reported good news, but I will remain skeptical until it's POSSIBLE to fill a creel limit on one of the party boats. Notice I said "possible". I am not advocating ANYONE to keep 15 Flounder, but we both know it has been YEARS since such an accomplishment was possible. I've seen plenty of days where the whole boat didn't catch 15 Flounder.
Maybe the DEC should consider raising Flounder fingerlings with an eye toward ressurecting a fishery that is in serious trouble, and has been for quite a while. As things stand now, if you sqwalk long enough, they will ask you "where do you want the Trout?" (which may be fine for anglers in Albany, but here on Long Island we have different needs).
I don't have the answers, but I'm glad to see that SOMEONE is asking the right questions!
Flounder (an appropriate screen name for this topic)
I'm one of those people who assumed you were targetting Flounder out of season.
It just seemed you were talking about fishing for them in Massapequa Cove CURRENTLY. It was only AFTER you said "why are these people telling me about the season?" that I went back and re-read your original post. The word "TODAY" was not in it (as you know) but it SEEMED that way the first time around. Sorry.
To answer your question, no, I don't think Stripers are responsible for the shortage of Flounder. In the glory days, when you could fill a bushel with flounder on any outing, the Bass were more numerous than now. I don't believe it's the Seals or the Cormorants either. No predator is responsible, and that includes man. Welll maybe man is a little responsible...let me explain.
Vacuum dredging kills thousands of immature Flounder daily. Heavy metals on the bottom make many historical spawning sites toxic. I've seen thousands of dead, immature Flounder no bigger than your thumbnail in both Manhasset and Little Neck Bays. Even (gasp) commercial fishermen cannot compare to the losses due to habitat degradation. There is no relief in sight.
The diver who saw Flounder on every drop in the State Boat Channel sure reported good news, but I will remain skeptical until it's POSSIBLE to fill a creel limit on one of the party boats. Notice I said "possible". I am not advocating ANYONE to keep 15 Flounder, but we both know it has been YEARS since such an accomplishment was possible. I've seen plenty of days where the whole boat didn't catch 15 Flounder.
Maybe the DEC should consider raising Flounder fingerlings with an eye toward ressurecting a fishery that is in serious trouble, and has been for quite a while. As things stand now, if you sqwalk long enough, they will ask you "where do you want the Trout?" (which may be fine for anglers in Albany, but here on Long Island we have different needs).
I don't have the answers, but I'm glad to see that SOMEONE is asking the right questions!
Flounder (an appropriate screen name for this topic)
Joined
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2,425 Posts
Danny boy,
If I misread your question, I apologize! Since you posted the question on the 12/10?. I immediately assumed that you were targeting flounder on that date ?therefore I jumped the gun and stupid me ? I also posted the wrong dates.
Instead of typing the word ?open?, I typed? (closed from September 15 to November 30th). The correct information is supposed to be? (OPEN from September 15 to November 30th).
However, If in fact you were targeting flounder on the said date (12/10) you would have been fishing illegally. That was my original point!
Anyway? The flounder fishery has been in it?s worse stages since the mid 80?s and it?s NOT making a comeback!
Opinari is 100% correct when he said? he does not believe the Stripers are the main cause of the decline. It?s the fishing pressure from the recreational and commercial entities! I agree with him but I also believe that there are other factors involved.
As for Iningolob?s comment?. Although we have seen more seals around our waters, I still don?t believe that?s part of the problem!
Capt. Neil brought a valid point? During the 70?s and early 80?s, we used to have harsh winters with cooler waters and subsequently, that was also the period where flounder were abundant. Since the El Nino?s weather trends, the flounder fishery declined and it?s not the same anymore.
Also Mr. Flounder brought out a legitimate concern ?. Dredging! But do we really know how devastating it is? Dunno.
The bottom line is that we have a serious problem here! Like the whiting and cod fishery we once had the flounder is heading that same direction. Something needs to be addressed because the future does not look bright at all.
All in all, this is an excellent topic that needs further investigation!
"Crazy" Alberto
[email protected]
If I misread your question, I apologize! Since you posted the question on the 12/10?. I immediately assumed that you were targeting flounder on that date ?therefore I jumped the gun and stupid me ? I also posted the wrong dates.
Instead of typing the word ?open?, I typed? (closed from September 15 to November 30th). The correct information is supposed to be? (OPEN from September 15 to November 30th).
However, If in fact you were targeting flounder on the said date (12/10) you would have been fishing illegally. That was my original point!
Anyway? The flounder fishery has been in it?s worse stages since the mid 80?s and it?s NOT making a comeback!
Opinari is 100% correct when he said? he does not believe the Stripers are the main cause of the decline. It?s the fishing pressure from the recreational and commercial entities! I agree with him but I also believe that there are other factors involved.
As for Iningolob?s comment?. Although we have seen more seals around our waters, I still don?t believe that?s part of the problem!
Capt. Neil brought a valid point? During the 70?s and early 80?s, we used to have harsh winters with cooler waters and subsequently, that was also the period where flounder were abundant. Since the El Nino?s weather trends, the flounder fishery declined and it?s not the same anymore.
Also Mr. Flounder brought out a legitimate concern ?. Dredging! But do we really know how devastating it is? Dunno.
The bottom line is that we have a serious problem here! Like the whiting and cod fishery we once had the flounder is heading that same direction. Something needs to be addressed because the future does not look bright at all.
All in all, this is an excellent topic that needs further investigation!
"Crazy" Alberto
[email protected]
Joined
·
2,718 Posts
Dannyboy:I think that there are a few reasons why the flounder population is in decline. True, bass seals and cormorants are doing some damage, but the biggest threat to winter flounder is a practice called FYKE FISHING!! This type of fixed gear targets pre-spawn fish in the bays during the winter and early spring. A low net is set on the bottom paralell to the shore,the flounder run into the "leader" and end up swimming into the "hoops" at the end of the rig, where theyare unable to get out. The hypocrasy of this is that the DEC issues permits for this on on one hand but preaches about letting the fish spawn before recreational anglers and other commercial fishermen take them!Call and write your state representatives and let them know how you feel about this. We are all entitled to this resource, but it seems unfair that a very small number of fishermen seem to go against all the regs with the blessing og the DEC. LATER
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