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I just chased Alex and Loligo out of my "Older American Diesel Pickups" thread so Alex promptly started this thread, which is the perfect forum for the classic Foreign vs. Domestic debate on Noreast


So all of you foreign-haters and foreign-lovers can duke it out right here!
 

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our grandchildren will know poverty.

Our parents: "Making the world a better place for our kids"

Nowadays:

"I'm getting my boobs done, my lips done, some botulism on my wrinkles, my beach house, my cocaine, I don't have enough money to buy anything of quality, I have to buy cheap imported stuff that I throw away every year because I just can't afford the good stuff anymore.. it doesn't have to be good just cheap, I'll use it once and throw it away"

Or put a "prada" label on a 10 dollar pocketbook and now you have $1800 quality... suckers...
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Actually Sortie, I don't think you chased me out. As a matter of fact if you look back at my replies to your thread they were informative and focused on what your looking for, i.e. an older American diesel pickup to tow your boat around.

I made suggestions concerning the Dodge Cummins Series and Ford Powerstroke and a joke about the Tundra. :)

I even took a minute to look some possibilities up for you on ebay...if you care to re-read the post you will see I was actually helpful to you.

You did not chase me out, and although tempted I did not hi-jack that thread; instead I wanted it to be informative for you so you can make an educated decision.

Anyway here are some highlights:

"Ford's car sales plummeted 24 percent for all of 2007 as some models like the Ford Mustang aged and a new Ford Taurus sedan was unable to match the volumes of the older version. Ford also cut rental-car sales by 32 percent over the year. Truck sales were down 5 percent.

Ford corporate historian Bob Kreipke said it was the first time since 1931 that Ford wasn't second behind GM in U.S. sales.

Ford shares fell 15 cents to $6.45 in afternoon trading after sinking to a new 52-week low of $6.44 earlier in the session. GM shares lost 53 cents to $23.88 after dropping to a 52-week low of $23.34 earlier in the day. Toyota's U.S. shares rose 25 cents to $106.71 in afternoon trading in New York.
 

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How many times do we need to debate this????? If American car companies want to stay in business then they should build a better product at a better price. Period.

When the american car buyer believes that he is buying A BETTER CAR AT A BETTER PRICE then the american car companies will be healthy.
Buying American for the sake of American is not healthy for either the consumer OR the car company.

Frankly, I'm surprised it took Toyota as long as it did. Believe me ,if the wanted to, they could have outsold Ford years ago. THEY CHOSE NOT TO inorder to avoid protectionist sentiment( like some members here feel) The Japanese are very image conscious and have , for years, developed a strategy of winning over american car buyers through loyalty, and politically correct moves. If it was based soley on price and qualtiy, they would have buried FORD a long time ago.
 

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GradySailfish wrote:
Actually Sortie, I don't think you chased me out.you're right, Alex. I should have included an emoticon (or thirty) to indicate that I was being facetious. Your comments were helpful and I'm grateful for them.

(having said that, in both the thread title and the initial post I DID discourage members from raising the foreign vs U.S. issue and both you and Loligo ignored it
)
 

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PURSUITWA wrote:
How many times do we need to debate this????? If American car companies want to stay in business then they should build a better product at a better price. Period.

When the american car buyer believes that he is buying A BETTER CAR AT A BETTER PRICE then the american car companies will be healthy.
Buying American for the sake of American is not healthy for either the consumer OR the car company.

Frankly, I'm surprised it took Toyota as long as it did. Believe me ,if the wanted to, they could have outsold Ford years ago. THEY CHOSE NOT TO inorder to avoid protectionist sentiment( like some members here feel) The Japanese are very image conscious and have , for years, developed a strategy of winning over american car buyers through loyalty, and politically correct moves. If it was based soley on price and qualtiy, they would have buried FORD a long time ago.

I have four Chevy's... One will be a 20 year old classic next year
..runs like a kitten to this day and glides on the beach.. to each his own..as a native american I always look for the made in the USA label you can keep your imports...


And try putting this on your Toyota


To each his own.. I'd be embarrassed to drive an import actually.. does anyone think they're the envy of the neighboorhood in thier Hyundai?
 

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likeitreallyis wrote:
PURSUITWA said:
H
And try putting this on your Toyota


To each his own.. I'd be embarrassed to drive an import actually.. does anyone think they're the envy of the neighboorhood in thier Hyundai?


Come on you gotta do better than ask if the Toyota has a bed mounted camper ask and you shall receive and as far as the Hyundau there 1 of the best small suvs and cars on the road today for the money with the best warranty, Why would you want a camper back on your pickup when toyota makes these for the beach

This post edited by STRIKERTHREE 05:25 PM 01/03/2008
 

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and all this from a UNION guy..


you guys want and want but keep buying those imports and striking for more money see how long that lasts when your OWN people push imports as being better than stuff you build yourselves :confused:
 

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I own a 97 toyota that I bought new. Since then, I'v owned 4 GMC SUV"S. Before that I owned a 1990 Toyota 4 runner. Yes the American cars weer bigger. But there is no way they matched the quality, dependability and resale the that my toyota had. ( I still own the 97 Camry and it runs like a charm.

To each his own but to assume that buying American ( protectionist)is a good thing in the long run is so economically misplaced that I won't even go into the umpteen reasons its bad for this country.
 

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likeitreallyis wrote:
and all this from a UNION guy..


you guys want and want but keep buying those imports and striking for more money see how long that lasts when your OWN people push imports as being better than stuff you build yourselves :confused:


I buy an import that supports american jobs most american cars are made in Mexico heres a 1978 1 ton toyota dual rear wheels with 278k still hauling a camper back.

And it would be very hard to import anything thats better than what my company distributes
 

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I agree with you don't buy just because but this is what I can tell you:

I own 19 Penn reels. 18b of them were made in Philedelphia and some are 25 years old and I use every season. The 19th one my wife picked out for herself as she just got into fishing. It was made in China. HOWEVER the tackle store decides to sell it at the same American price... it is broken already and we bought it in August.

I had a pair of Cabelas waders made in the USA for over 10 years easy. Never patched never leaked. Ripped them one day and bought another pair because I liked them so much. Paid the SAME American price for a replacement pair....(made in China now.. surprise..)

This season, both seams are shot, can't even patch them as it appears to be a defect in the manufacturing process as the seams are looking and cared for the waders the same way....(lasted 1 1/2 years)...

Same American money, more snot nosed generation greed fueled by people like yourselves who keep the labor costs high in your unions and force some of these things into happening onto your kids...

wake up and smell the antifreeze. I mean toothpaste. I mean a cup of the cheapest stuff the chinese can pass off as coffee.



 

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likeitreallyis wrote:


Same American money, more snot nosed generation greed fueled by people like yourselves who keep the labor costs high in your unions and force some of these things into happening onto your kids...

wake up and smell the antifreeze. I mean toothpaste. I mean a cup of the cheapest stuff the chinese can pass off as coffee.







And what do call high labor its called cost of living what would your pay be for someone who has a specific trade, most of your trade unions are payed nice wages there are other non skilled union workers who are paid accordingly to their skill set
 

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oh boy dont even get me started in this thread...
my 91 that i sold but wish i never did...some guy from oregon bought it on ebay. had 196,000 and runnin strong!



my 4runner now has 205,000 miles on it and still using everyday for work (100 miles a day)


my FJ this is a fisherman's dream..all i have to say

let see a Chevy/ford do this with out having a wheel in the air because the suspension is to limited..

i for 1 am now going to own yota's for therest of my life...there track record with me is just to good.
if Toyota's made motorcycle id buy them to...


This post edited by toyotaoffroad91 07:08 PM 01/03/2008
 

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How many Fords are there in Japan?


Talk about protectionism. Ok I'm done. You buy your imports I'll keep everyone honest by looking for that made in the USA label.

Anybody know a good reel manufacturer in the US? Besides VS

Or have all those jobs shipped out too for better warrenties


and less pay and benefits for the people that build them..


God bless our kids.
 

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likeitreallyis wrote:
How many Fords are there in Japan?


Talk about protectionism. Ok I'm done. You buy your imports I'll keep everyone honest by looking for that made in the USA label.

Anybody know a good reel manufacturer in the US? Besides VS

Or have all those jobs shipped out too for better warrenties


and less pay and benefits for the people that build them..


God bless our kids.


Don't know about Japan but their all over Mexico geezz I wonder why

Avet is made in the USA

and next time you buy that "American" car look to see where its really made
 

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Unrealated to the Quality Debate

The red Herring in this whole "Ford is loosing market share due to QUALITY" debate is the omission of the fact that since March of 2006 there has been a building BOYCOTT against the Ford motor company by main faith/family based organizations. As of July 2007 there were over 720,000 people pledged to boycott Ford products in support of the AFA's position that Ford is "a leading promoter of same-sex marriage and the homosexual agenda". No matter where you personally stand on those particular issues (that's for another time/thread), several hundred thousand people around the country have decided not to buy their products for those reasons, and not necessarily because one is better than another.

Article from the AFA

Home of the Boycott

I'd put more weight into repair history, service costs and the like than just sales going up or down.
 

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Don't get me wrong unions are great and needed.

The high labor costs cannot be continued if the money and jobs going overseas can no longer support them is my point...

To be honest my first truck was a Toyota. It was a great truck and they are a legitimate competitor and can sell a good product here. My beef is more towards a great product like Penn, a US born company, selling out completely, selling such crap at the same price and when you expect the same quality all you get is garbage and know that 99 percent of the profit went to the top end people and not the poor slob in China at 3 cents per hour with no health benefits at the same time the craftsman in Philadelphia is sucking wind because his job has been outsourced....

Very touchy subject with me so I'll leave here and enjoy the rest of the thread.



 
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