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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi Al and everyone else,

I can't seem to break the 25 pound mark for stripers. I can catch enough bass that I am confident in my abilities
to catch fish, but I can't seem to cull a real cow. I was looking for some tips on how I might find some of the bigger girls. I remember a topic about this not too long ago but I can't seem to find it with a search.

I usually get out about 6 times a week for a few hours to 15 minutes at a time. I fish from the boat, predominately out of FI inlet and Moriches. And I surfcast on the North Shore, "The End" and the South Shore. I only use lures in the surf (plugs, bucktails and rubber shads). On the boat, I usually use lures, but have started using live shad and clams. Also, I often fish in less traveled areas that don't have a lot of pressure, but they all seem to have the same size fish.

Any tips on lures and/or presentation are appreciated.
 

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Some observations I made with the bigger fish.....

first off sorry for chiming in if this for Crazy Al only but here goes.
The big fish often { not allways by a long shot} school together.
About 3 years ago during the fall run there were big bass brought into my marina day after day being jigged up using krockadile lures which were working daddy bunker out around 50' JI..
I think the combo of the " fall run" with fish hitting schools of bunker or live eels @ night seem to produce big fish.
I often wonder if the majority of big bass are caught in the surf, ocean with eels @ night or the fall run in inlets ect.
I guess I'm stating some obvious facts here but I too am interested in what folk have to add .
I caught my second largest fish this season on a white bucktail, state channel, 30 lbs. so who knows?
I want a taste of a 40+ lb fish too.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Alan,

Any and all comments/suggestions are welcome. Thank you for yours. I am just hoping that I don't have to wait until next fall to catch a cow. Not that another year would really make a difference (lol).

I have only been surf fishing seriously since last summer. I still have a lot to learn about fishing the suds in general.
 

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BIG BASS

I'll preface my remarks by letting you know that all of my bass fishing is on the East End--Gut/Race/Gardiners in the Spring and Summer and Montauk in the fall.

I do get some big bass in the Spring Run on bucks and diamond jigs but they are not numerous. Earlier this month we had several in the 25+ pound range in the Race.
I see larger fish while chunking in the Sluiceway at night in the summer--we've had several nights with fish of 35-45lbs.

In early December we get a lot of larger fish during the Montauk hering run. My favorite fishing--fish on every drift.
 

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Hi Doughboy,

Moriches Inlet is my playground and I have caught some good bass in it over the years.

In my experience live bunker are the best bait to consistently pull out #30’s and better. Butterfish and shad are also great. I am getting a lot of butterfish now but they are not around during the summer and fall so I do not use them when most of the big bass are around. Shad are also great (the bigger the better) but again it’s mostly a spring run.

The first good body of large fish seemed to move in a week or to ago and I hit some in the low #30’s on live butterfish at night.

Increase your odds by fishing at night. I am not so concerned about tide at night with live bunker, big bass just can’t seem to refuse them negative, neutral or aggressive.

In the fall live eels are a close second and easier to get. I know many, many bass are caught on live eels, especially from the surf. I think this is due more to the fact that they are so much easier to get (just buy some), to keep, and cast compared to bunker, than the fact that bass actually like them better than bunker. I would take a live bunker, any day, any time, anywhere over a live eel, hands down.

And do not forget the ugly little bergall, easy to get, easy to keep. It is not as tempting it seems as bunker but that little fish has saved many a trip when the others where not available.

In the inlet I run the live bait on a fish finder rig and keep it within 3 ft. of the bottom. Single Gamakatsu forward of dorsal and 50 lb. flouro. Work the usual drop-offs, give the cuts a try and do not overlook shallow bars during the night.

If you want to get a cow on an artificial, think buck tail / soft body jig and think BIG. I do best on 6 to 9 inch shad bodies on 3 to 5 oz. heads. Or large spro’s tipped with a large plastic curly tails ( XPS series. Mugumbo etc.)

When I am targeting big bass with big live bait it is common for every boat around me to be hooking up with keepers as I go drift after drift without even a hit. You just have to stick with the game plan and she will come, she will come big!

If you want any advice on how and where to catch live bait in the Moriches area e-mail me.

Good luck,

Waveguide on the side.
 

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Hello Doughboy,

Most of the answers that are provided are excellent and proven deadly by pro's and novices.

Like MakoMike said…"… most of the bigger fish are taken on bait, particularly eels all year long and herring in the late fall."

MakoMike said… I see larger fish while chunking in the Sluiceway at night in the summer…
In early December we get a lot of larger fish during the Montauk hering run. "


waveguide1 reveals many good tips and he said…" …Increase your odds by fishing at night. I am not so concerned about tide at night with live bunker, big bass just can't seem to refuse them negative, neutral or aggressive. In the fall live eels are a close second and easier to get. I know many, many bass are caught on live eels, especially from the surf. …..You just have to stick with the game plan and she will come, she will come big!

Onthefly also brings a valid point… he said …" A state fisheries biolgist told me that the bigger bass prefer a bigger bait. Since it takes them more energy to chase food than smaller fish, they want to make it count. "

In my opinion, Large presentation is also a must and knowing where they roam is key! Inlets, cuts, deep rips, strong structural bars (near big water), with plenty of large bait presence is an excellent sign for the elusive cow!

I am also an avid plug/lure tosser and when searching for the true mother…. Once again, I think BIG and I work areas where there are minimal boats and that's usually the late weeknights hours! … That's when they are most vulnerable!;)

As for season… Well, the past few weeks big bait (big bunker, Herring & shad) swam our local waters and a few brutes were caught!

Now that we got some big fish tactics down... How critical do you think the tide and moon makes for those true cows?

"Crazy" Alberto
[email protected]
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Thanks everyone for your replys. I guess I will just have to wait and she will come. I have been doing a lot of what was suggested. Big baits and big lures around secluded structure. A few of my favorite lures for bass fishing are the 6 inch blue back bass assassins and rainbow or alwive 7 inch Fin-S, but it is amazing how small some of the fish are that I catch on these bigger lures.

Al, I feel that I am not qualified to answer your question since I have not landed a "cow" (lol). Seriously though, every time I think I have tides and currents figured out for the fish, I find them doing the exact opposite. Typically, I prefer the the full or new moon phases on the begining of an ebb tide. Where I fish in GSB/FI inlet I feel there isn't really enough current on nights like tonight to make the fish really relate to structure. Early in the season though, in colder cleaner water, I found fish schooling in the top/bottom/ebb/flood/slack tides. It didn't matter what the tide was as long as it was early morning. I have also done very well earlier this year at slack high for bass.

The patterns are ever changing. I was weakfish fishing in May a few times when I believed conditions would be perfect, Tide begining to ebb in the evening after the sun had all day to warm the water. I would manage a few fish, but my brother who would go out in the middle of the day, bottom of the tides, with tons of boats traffic would do even better.

A few years ago, I found a couple week period where BIG weaks were schooling by the lighthouse in the middle of the hot summer day, bottom of the ebb with water the color of mud.

So bottom line, when is the best time/tide/moon to fish? When the fish are biting and when you can get out.
 

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doughboy wrote:
… Seriously though, every time I think I have tides and currents figured out for the fish, I find them doing the exact opposite. ..
____________________________________

LOLOLOL… Doughboy, Welcome to the crazy world of fishing! :) This is why we love this sport so much. Just when you thought you might have them figured out… they will change pattern on ya. But in most cases, if you stick to the basic "hunting" mode…. You will locate them. That is why it's a good idea to constantly move around… and check for new things. My motto of fishing: Work the obvious and check out the NOT so obvious… you will never know.;)

…Where I fish in GSB/FI inlet I feel there isn't really enough current on nights like tonight to make the fish really relate to structure….

That's a good point… Since we are off the high/new moon phases…. The standard first and last hours of the tide does not work (slow moving water)… but to solve that problem I work the 2nd or 3rd hour of the tide (where there is stronger water movement) which is equivalent to the first of the new or full moon! One thing we have to understand… fish are not on the clock (we are) … therefore, you have to work with the water (current) movement accordingly. I hope I make sense here…. Please let me know if you need more clarification!

…A few years ago, I found a couple week period where BIG weaks were schooling by the lighthouse in the middle of the hot summer day, bottom of the ebb with water the color of mud.

Strangely enough…. Weakfish have no problem feeding in muddy waters and it appears that you found them in the "staging" mode! Most of my best weakfish action usually happens during the last of moving tide… even during the muddy waters. IMO - This is where the color "yellow" stands out and when you have a yellow lure with lots of vibration… Your odds will increase! ;)

"Crazy" Alberto
[email protected]
 

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KAREN ANN,on big rock

Big fish like a big tide,in general if your targeting big fish the periods of 4 days on the upside of the moons and down side will give you the harder tides,what you catch between the moons,determines your ability and knowledge to adjust to these conditions.Although big fish may like a bigger bait,I have caught many big fish on small baits.The biggest factors I feel in targeting big fish is attention to details,you can control many of the variables regarding presentation;leader length,weight,line size,and so on,these variables tip the scales toward you if you play them right.
 

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Big Bass

I've found that most big bass enjoy the slower moving water in the protection of structure. On the N. Fork, most of the big bass I've caught were not in the popular spots like the rips of the Race and the Gut. I think the larger fish are lazier and don't like to work as hard. They hide behind the structure and wait for a meal to come floating by. The smaller fish seem to spend more time in the rips.

And yes CA, tide is a major factor. On the moons, I've found the first and last hours of the tide (while its not cranking as hard) to be most productive for bigger fish. It's also **** near impossible to anchor when the tide runs hardest--and who enjoys fishing with 16+ oz of lead! Off the moons, the middle of the tide is best.
 
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