i hope someone can answer this question. a few times i have seen rods where the first guide closest to the reel seat is placed on top where it should, then the other guides start to wrap around the blank as you get closer to the tip until the last guide/tip is facing the opposite direction. so it pretty much looks like the first guide is on top, and the last guide and tip are on the bottom. it must sound a little confusing, but i know someone out there knows that i am talking about, i was wondering why this is done. thanks
strange guide placement
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Acid Wrap
Well, I just found out about this too, it's called spiral wrap or acid wrap, and it seems that it's to prevent the natural twist of a rod under load. Normally when you place guides on a casting or trolling rod, the guides are placed along the spine, which is on the top of the rod, but when a load is placed on the rod, the action of the fish pulling tends to want the rod to spin around so the curve of the rod is down, as in a spinning rod. So, in order to relieve the stress on the fisher, the guides spin along the length of the rod so that the final one or two end up 180 away form the reel. I hope you understand my poor descripton. There's a board called allcoast sportfishing that seems to deal with lots of acid wraps. It appears that they use this on the left coast more than the right coast.
Well, I just found out about this too, it's called spiral wrap or acid wrap, and it seems that it's to prevent the natural twist of a rod under load. Normally when you place guides on a casting or trolling rod, the guides are placed along the spine, which is on the top of the rod, but when a load is placed on the rod, the action of the fish pulling tends to want the rod to spin around so the curve of the rod is down, as in a spinning rod. So, in order to relieve the stress on the fisher, the guides spin along the length of the rod so that the final one or two end up 180 away form the reel. I hope you understand my poor descripton. There's a board called allcoast sportfishing that seems to deal with lots of acid wraps. It appears that they use this on the left coast more than the right coast.
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10,661 Posts
Reef Man and AnglerAl
Hi,
What you are referring to was originally known as a "ROBERTS WRAP".
The idea is about 90 years old. I have know about it for maybe 25 years. The internet has made it a buzz word. All of a sudden it is big news.
I guess maybe its time has come.
Some call it a "SPIRAL WRAP". On the West Coast it is called an "ACID WRAP".
It works! Some fishermen agree it works BUT would not be caught dead using one. Just like a friend of mine who won't even try using my rod that is wrapped with purple thread.
Capt Neil
Hi,
What you are referring to was originally known as a "ROBERTS WRAP".
The idea is about 90 years old. I have know about it for maybe 25 years. The internet has made it a buzz word. All of a sudden it is big news.
I guess maybe its time has come.
Some call it a "SPIRAL WRAP". On the West Coast it is called an "ACID WRAP".
It works! Some fishermen agree it works BUT would not be caught dead using one. Just like a friend of mine who won't even try using my rod that is wrapped with purple thread.
Capt Neil
Thanks guys, that is exactly what i was talking about! i think i will give it a try this winter on one of the rods i am going to build. i want to maybe build the Calstar 700M i have been reading so much about, and a baitcasting rod to replace one i had snap on me in montauk last summer. it was a lamiglass WMB842F. a few years before i started building rods i had one built for my father on that blank and it snapped twice on me. once on the butt section, i got it fixed, then it snapped right after the grip. the one i built snapped in the butt right before the reel seat. luckily i grabbed the top before the reel, and the rest of the rod (with SiC guides!) went over into the deep. i wasn't even using braided line, i was using mono. when i had first got the blank i noticed it was kinda thin but didn't think anything of it. Capt Neil have you had or heard of any problems with this blank?
thanks guys
thanks guys
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10,661 Posts
Reef Man
Hi,
It is unusual for blanks to break in the butt section. That area has additional support from the grips and reel seat.
I have broken a fiberglas rod just in front of the fore grip. HOWEVER, it was my fault!!!!! I was mule hauling 10 lb blues in a rush. I even watched the blank lose its hoop strength as it elongated.
I have seen the results of a graphite rod break in the butt grip. It broke where the blank had been extended, in other words a blank within a blank which is very strong. The customer said it broke while fighting a fluke. I THINK NOT!!!!!! I had the remains of the rod in my hands. It broke in 3 pieces, below the tip, above the fore grip and in the butt grip. Interestingly, the reel drag was locked tight. The break in the butt was right where the butt would lean against a rod holder. Yes, I would like to know what really happened.
I don't know how your MB 842F was used or for what. They are good blanks. Let me know what was going on when they broke.
Have you tried a Lamiglas CGBT 841L? A great, very sensitive, strong composite blank.
Capt Neil
Hi,
It is unusual for blanks to break in the butt section. That area has additional support from the grips and reel seat.
I have broken a fiberglas rod just in front of the fore grip. HOWEVER, it was my fault!!!!! I was mule hauling 10 lb blues in a rush. I even watched the blank lose its hoop strength as it elongated.
I have seen the results of a graphite rod break in the butt grip. It broke where the blank had been extended, in other words a blank within a blank which is very strong. The customer said it broke while fighting a fluke. I THINK NOT!!!!!! I had the remains of the rod in my hands. It broke in 3 pieces, below the tip, above the fore grip and in the butt grip. Interestingly, the reel drag was locked tight. The break in the butt was right where the butt would lean against a rod holder. Yes, I would like to know what really happened.
I don't know how your MB 842F was used or for what. They are good blanks. Let me know what was going on when they broke.
Have you tried a Lamiglas CGBT 841L? A great, very sensitive, strong composite blank.
Capt Neil
Capt Neil,
Both of them were pretty much used for fluke fishing, and also sea bass and porgy fishing. it was a great porgy rod since it was more of a moderate action rod so it would absorb the porgy's head shaking so no hooks would pull. it is rated as a fast action rod but it was really a moderate action rod. the first time the rod i had built from Beckman's B&T snapped i was casting out a light jig to a school of blues and it snapped pretty much in the middle of the butt grip. i brought the rod in, they fixed it, and not too long after that my father was fighting a schoolie striper he hooked into while reef fishing and it snapped again right after the fore grip. the one that i built snapped while i was fluke fishing in montauk. the rod was in a road holder and a fish hit it and snapped it in the butt section. i never fish locked drags so that's not why it snapped. when i got both rods they were really hollow, in fact you could pretty much see light through them. i could see if just one of them was defective, but to get the same blank two times, and both times it snaps is just a little crazy. well now i have a full set of SiC guides that i just took off of it today that i plan on using for another rod. what line class is that rod you said rated for Capt?
Both of them were pretty much used for fluke fishing, and also sea bass and porgy fishing. it was a great porgy rod since it was more of a moderate action rod so it would absorb the porgy's head shaking so no hooks would pull. it is rated as a fast action rod but it was really a moderate action rod. the first time the rod i had built from Beckman's B&T snapped i was casting out a light jig to a school of blues and it snapped pretty much in the middle of the butt grip. i brought the rod in, they fixed it, and not too long after that my father was fighting a schoolie striper he hooked into while reef fishing and it snapped again right after the fore grip. the one that i built snapped while i was fluke fishing in montauk. the rod was in a road holder and a fish hit it and snapped it in the butt section. i never fish locked drags so that's not why it snapped. when i got both rods they were really hollow, in fact you could pretty much see light through them. i could see if just one of them was defective, but to get the same blank two times, and both times it snaps is just a little crazy. well now i have a full set of SiC guides that i just took off of it today that i plan on using for another rod. what line class is that rod you said rated for Capt?
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10,661 Posts
Reef Man
Hi,
Hmmmm! Strange about those 2 blanks. Wish I had a better answer for you.
The CGBT 841L composite is rated for 20 # test line. A sweet blank. They are "special order" from distributor. I have one in stock that I will build as a demo for next summer. If you would like to see the blank come on over or remind me to bring it to the Lindenhurst Fishermans Flea Market, Nov 30.
On the Sea Otter, Capt Joel likes the CGBT 841 ML rated for 25 # test line.
Capt Neil
Hi,
Hmmmm! Strange about those 2 blanks. Wish I had a better answer for you.
The CGBT 841L composite is rated for 20 # test line. A sweet blank. They are "special order" from distributor. I have one in stock that I will build as a demo for next summer. If you would like to see the blank come on over or remind me to bring it to the Lindenhurst Fishermans Flea Market, Nov 30.
On the Sea Otter, Capt Joel likes the CGBT 841 ML rated for 25 # test line.
Capt Neil
This is just a theory but could be the answer. Did your rod have a decorative diamond or chevron wrap? If it did the reason for the break location could be associated with the person building the rod. They may have cut too deep when cutting the tie ends with a blade. If they cut too deep and put finish on top the fibers may break below the finish and eventually give out. Just a theory.
Hi Capt Neil:
I booked a trip on the Celtic Quest. I'm dying to give those Buck Toothed, Bait Stealing, White Chinned critters a lip piercing. I'll keep you posted.
Regards,
Rockin
Hi Capt Neil:
I booked a trip on the Celtic Quest. I'm dying to give those Buck Toothed, Bait Stealing, White Chinned critters a lip piercing. I'll keep you posted.
Regards,
Rockin
Rockin, the one i got from Beckmans didnt have a fancy wrap, but the one i built did have a very nice diamond wrap, but thats not where that one broke. Like i said before the blanks were very thin, so thin that you could see light through them. I am going to email Lamiglas and see what they say.
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10,661 Posts
John B
Hi John,
Thanks for putting the picture up.
Some bend in that rod.
John, the black fishing is the best that I ever remember up on the Sound. Get on a plane and get up here. I live so close and i don't have the time to go fishing. My friends have me drooling with the stories of the bite going on.
BUY, then again you catch all the hugh grouper in the Gulf.
Have a Happy Thanksgiving!
Neil
Hi John,
Thanks for putting the picture up.
Some bend in that rod.
John, the black fishing is the best that I ever remember up on the Sound. Get on a plane and get up here. I live so close and i don't have the time to go fishing. My friends have me drooling with the stories of the bite going on.
BUY, then again you catch all the hugh grouper in the Gulf.
Have a Happy Thanksgiving!
Neil
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