[619627]

I got my copy of the COMMERCIAL FISHING NEWS the other day, and lo and behold, their was a little story on the striped bass quota, that should have some of you guys scratching your heads. The article,

"ASFMC GIVES FINAL APPROVAL TO STRIPED BASS QUOTA HIKE"

was extremely interesting, especially if you are a commercial fishermen! The article goes on to state, and i am taking this verbatim, "that despite last ditch campaigning by some RECREATIONAL fishing groups to stop it, ATLANTIC STATES MARINE FISHERIES COMMISSION has approved a: 42% increase in state commercial striped bass quotas effective this year. After years of constrained effort, recreational and commercial fishermen will begin to realize the benefits of a restored resource, ASMFC said, explaining that recreational catches 'MAY' be allowed to go up 10-15% in 2004".

Now i do remember many irate fishermen on the board reaching for their digitalis heart medicine when i posted a item pushing for support for a 2 fish striped bass limit. And as i have written about in the Fluke thread on the rules of Bargaining & Negotiating, is that 'when something is offered, without giving up anything, you take it', a large group of fishermen here wanted to keep the 1 fish limit. Well the resource is going to be put to good use by the commercial sector, this season.

By the way, the article ended with this: "According to ASFMC, the increase in striped bass quota contained in Amendment 6, represents JUST 4% of total striped bass landings in recent years". I hope you understand what this last statement means.

What a shame....if the recreational sector would of fought for 2 striped bass and gotten it, the total increased take of bass would not have effected stocks!

EC NEWELL MAN*

 

[strip]

Thanks EC

You guys didn't think that 2nd bass you were willing to give up was going to be given to the commercial guys huh?

 

[Leprechaun]

Just disgusting.

It shows not only that the rec sector is still willing to make sacrifices to preserve the species, but also that we are just incredibly stupid and naive to think that a sacrifical attitude on our part would be reciprocated by the comms.

When have they NOT taken advantage?

Just more foolishness on our side of the equation.

rgds, Leprechaun

 

[Capt.XXX]

I'm GLAD...

Remember my post...

The New York State DEC wants the recreational angler to keep two (2) striped bass a day. If you don't vote for this, the extra striped bass WILL be given over to the comercial sector and they WILL KILL all of these extra striped bass. Please vote for the two (2) bass a day, if you release the fish you are SAVING striped bass from being KILLED!

Remember what our fearless leader said...

ONLY THE FACTS PLEASE!
In all due respect, while I appreciate the good Captains input there appears to be a few inaccuracies in his statement

1) The NYSDEC has NEVER said it wants us to take the 2 fish and I think it?s important that prospective people know that before voting.

2.) The extra striped bass will NOT be given to the commercials if we don?t take them. In fact we have been allowed these two fish for over 5-years now and they have never given them those fish.

Please folk?s lets keep this honest as that?s the only way it will have any value to our fisheries managers. If not they?ll have no choice but to ignore the data.

Respectfully,
George R. Scocca
Nor'east Saltwater

I'm not blaming you George, but I will say this...

"**** of a statement George!"

 

[Leprechaun]

Oy Vey.

Leprechaun

 

[skatemaster]

Can't blame the comms. It would be like you or me turning down the offer of a raise. But it would have been nice to score one for the recs. I do thank NY for this year's regs on sea bass, porgies, fluke and hopefully blackfish.

 

[617905]

"you guys didn't realize........"????

As I recall, some high profile, influential people who are "in the know" here were against the 2 fish idea. What seemed to be overlooked was that supporting it at this time would not have meant that it would have necessarily had to become a regulation. It would have been written in but not used until it was determined that it would not adversely affect the stock. Now, if there were a desire to bring it to two fish, we would have to go through the whole process all over again. Anyway, I guess at this point it's stripers under the bridge (and into the nets ) We giveith and the the commercials taketh away.

 

[MakoMike]

I think you guys are mixing apples and oranges. The increase in the recreational limit from one to two fish a day is still on the table. NY DEC has always said that it wasn't an option for this year, but maybe for next year. The increase in the commercial quota is payback for the cuts they took to get the population to where it is today. Even with that increase, they will have the same quota as they had before the population crash. ASMFC is not transferring quota from recs to commercials. If you NYers want it you can have a 2 fish limit in 2004, the increase in the commercial quota won't affect that.

 

[617905]

If that is in fact the case Mako

then I stand misinformed and corrected. (It wouldn't be the first time, and I'm sure it won't be the last) This legal stuff is all to confusing for me. I guess I should stick to provoking and comedic efforts. (ho boy! is my face red!)

 

[noreast]

That 2nd Bass Is Still Swimming . . .

As your ?fearless leader? I feel it?s my responsibility to point out that our not taking the second fish had ABSOLUTLEY NOTHING to do with the recent commercial increase,
and the DEC had ABSOULTELY NOTHING to do with ASMFC?s decision to increase commercial harvest.

The second fish option is not a NYS option is a coast wide option, and therefore our refusing to take the second fish can in no way effect the increase in the commercial catch.

To suggest that bass were taken from us and given to the commercials is 100% wrong, because nothing was taken form us. The second fish is still available to us just as it is the rest of the coast and the way the plan is set it is impossible for them to switch the quotas between the two.

This is not new to the conservation minded NY angler just as we saw back in 1995 when the plan called for the decrease from 36 to 28 inches for the coastal fishery every state on the coast went to 28-inches, except NY. Did they give those fish to some other user group? No those fish were available to us until we decided to reduced our limit to 28-inches a few years later. The same goes for the second bass option, it?s still there and we can take it anytime we want.

The striped bass management plan is broken into two managed stocks, coastal stock and producer areas. All bass in our marine district are managed under the coastal stock, and each state along the coast is allowed 2-fish at a 28-inch minimum or the conservation equivalent to that. That?s why the regulations vary from state to state, but overall each state must fall within the equivalent of two bass at 28 inches.

I have been heavily involved in the Striped Bass Management Plan for over a decade and I can tell you first hand that these are the facts, and the two fish option is still on the table and can NEVR be transferred to the commercials. And before they take it away from us they?ll have to do it to the rest of the coast at the same time, and with the recent commercial increase just handed out, we won?t be seeing that anytime soon.

 

[617905]

I knew that...

See??? I told you guys so.... right George?

 

[Capt.XXX]

I'll Believe It, When I See It!

BUT, I haven't seen it yet.

I'm just wondering -- what if...

NY State and the other Atlantic Seaboard states had given the extra Striped Bass towards the Recreational sector's quota. I wonder if they still would have increased the Commercial quota?

Something just tells me that it just wouldn't be so.

Any thoughts?

(This post edited by Capt.XXX on 04/16/2003)

 

[MakoMike]

XXX,
Many of the other states went up to two fish a day. RI did and MA and NH are still contemplating it. It was all part of the same plan, i.e. the two fish option and the commercial increase that was approved all in one vote by the ASMFC.

 

[noreast]

XXX,

What you need to understand is that the plan assumes all participating states are fishing on their max, but not all fisheries are managed that way.

Now if you were talking bluefish that would in fact be the case. Since the start of the bluefish plan we have seen the recreational quota go from 80% of the total catch to a less than 50% of the catch this year. That is a result of a plan that transfers unused quotas; all of the fish that we don?t catch are given over to the commercials. That is why I have endorsed taking the 15 fish per man that we?re allowed under the plan. I fully realize that 10 are plenty, but by being conservative we?re loosing the fishery and we need to catch our quota.

So with striped bass we will not be penalized for being conservative, but with bluefish we?re really getting hammered.

 

[618198]

Thanks george!

For clearing that up.....I feel relieved about that and I agree about the Bluefish. I guess I thought it was a similar deal on the Bass.

 

[Capt.XXX]

I gottcha on that George...

But I still wonder if...

NY State and the other Atlantic Seaboard states had given the extra Striped Bass towards the Recreational sector's quota. I wonder if they still would have increased the Commercial quota?

 

[MakoMike]

XXX,
RI did bump the limit to two and MA & NH are contempating doing the same, so I guess the answer has to be, that there would be no effect.

 

[Capt.XXX]

MM -- I don't think so...

When I went to school comtemplating didn't mean the same as instituted.

So, It's really NOT the same... Right?

(This post edited by Capt.XXX on 04/17/2003)

 

[Gooch]

if the commercials are getting a "payback" for years of restrictions and reccreationals possibly getting a second bass, what do we think is going to happen to the bass population?

 

[Hunt n' Fish]

XXX,

Wether or not the recs took the increase had absolutely no bearing on the commercial increase. Here in NY, the recs still may get the increase to two fish. That is up for discussion now, to be included for the regs for the 04 season. The commercials were granted an increase in NY of 200,000 lbs (from 600,000 to 800,000 lbs) for this season.

They have already taken that increase, independent of wether or not we take ours for NEXT season. If we don't take it, the increase IS NOT handed over to the commercial fisherman. They can still only get 800,000 lbs of fish.

Last year in NY, the recreational fisherman landed and kept about 3,000,000 lbs of bass (that figure does NOT include C & R landings) according to NMFS. The commercials got to keep only 600,000. This year it has gone up to 800,000 lbs. That is still smaller than a 75/25 split. And we recreationals complain about the 60/40 split that favors the commercials with fluke.