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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I want to cast farther with my conventional outfit. I got a 12' casting rod and a casting reel with levelwind. So far I can cast about 127 feet out. I read somewhere online it is better without levelwind in reel. Is it better to used a casting reel with levelwind or non-levelwind.

If you got a conventional surf outfit, what would you used to cast with?

What rig would you used to better casting bait out? Fishfinder or 3-way swivel bottom rig?
 

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You can usually cast a non-level wind reel further because the line comes straight off the reel to the guides. With a levelwind, the line might be angled off the spool and then rub as it goes through the levelwind. This causes your cast to loose energy and shorten the distance. Most conventional surf reels do not come with a level wind feature anyway.

There are a couple of other benefits to non levelwind reels over level wind.

-There is more room to clear the inevitable birdnests.

-If you snap off you line you don't have to resynchronize the line with the levelwind.

I have a 965, loaded with a braided line, on a seven foot medium rod I use mainly for boat fishing. Even with the level wind, I can cast a bucktail over 80 yards.

I am now looking into getting a conventional surf outfit. Cabela's has a St. Croix/Penn 525 mag combo for $350. The spool seems a bit small, but I am going to load it with braid anyway. Before I get that though I will check out the new 975 surf reel (winter projects). I am going to be using the rod for plug fishing.

If you are really interested in distance casting, they also have a Breakaway rod/Penn 525 mag combo for $450. They are advertising that the rod can make over 200 yard casts. I am sure that it is also reliant on the indivduals abilities. They also sell a special bait rig for long distance casting under the name of Breakaway.
 

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Please don't take this as a slam, because it isn't meant to be. But, if you're only casting 127 feet---roughly 43 yards----the problem isn't your reel, it's your casting technique. And going over to a non levelwind reel isn't going to add much, if anything, to your cast.

One of the problems might be that 12' rod. It's a load to handle and it might be affecting the mechanics of your cast. Starting on a 10' rod probably would nave been a lot better for learning how to cast conventional. I would guess you're probably just "throwing" the rod with sort of a lob motion, rather than loading it and using your hips and shoulders to rotate into the cast.

There are some good books and videos out there that might help you get the motion down.

As far as the difference in distance a level wind costs you--of course it varies from reel model to reel model and caster to caster. But it shouldn't be anything more than 10-15%. I remember an article in the On The Water magazine, where two staffers made 10 cats apiece with both the level wind Calcutta 400 and the non levelwind 400S. The mean (over 10 casts) difference was something like 3-5 yards. I find much the same thing to be true when I compare my distance, with lures, using a level wind Abu 7000 and a non levelwind 7500CT. In fact---when plugging---unless you have the talent to consistently lay the line level, you get better distance from a level wind. If your line isn't even, you often have to thumb the spool more to prevent a backlash, and this costs you distance.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
MikeP,
No, I dont feel affended at all. I took my reel apart and found a gear broken. That explains why I cannot cast that far. I will rent the tapes you fish masters suggested. I bought a new reel to see if it makes a difference.

MikeP, so you are saying it doesnot make too much difference if I used a Levelwind reel? I am using a 12' Ugly Stik casting rod, (NEW)a Okuma CN 30L reel, 30lb Trilene Big Game with 50lb shock leader, and 5 oz sinker.


The reel I used before was a Shimano TR200G. Got broken parts.

I will test the new outfit tomorrow in Coney Island. See you, catch more fish.

Thanks... <(*(0000<
 

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Great feedback from everyone. One more tip: keep your thumb all the way to the left side of the reel (if you are righthanded) and gently touch the spool - not the line - when you cast. This "educated thumb" will allow you to manage the spool speed in relation to the velocity of the bait/lure. When the lure begins to slow you need to gently apply pressure to the spool - not the line - with your thumb and this will reduce he delta from the two ends of the line traveling at different velocities. How much weight are your throwing? Look at the base of the rod by the handle and make sure you follow the weightclass listed. I feel optimum is usually 60 % to 80 % of the rod's rating. Ditto for the line. I use PowerPro and Fireline 50 lb and they both rock. To practice loading the rod, one simple technique to is false cast the rod in an arch which resembles your own natural casting rod. I go from no move than 90 degrees or 3 o'clock on the back cast (level with the ground if leader permits) to about ten o'clock on the front cast. Do not release, instead try to feel the rod "load" and use this springing dynamic to cast. In addition, at the end of the front cast do not let slack get in the line when practicing. Good luck.
 

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Seems this went from a reel question to casting techniques. There is a great book by the cast master himself, 5 time national casting champion and major competitor, Ron Arra. The title is called the ultimate guide to surfcasting copyright 2001. He has modified the pendulum cast that was mastered by John Holden. The work of these 2 men should be read by us all, they cast on average 750 feet!!!!
Now to change the subject to tackle:
Daiwa Emblem class reels are excellent, so are the Abu Garcia Ambassadeur 6500 c3 ct mag and the level wind version 6500c3 mag, 6500 c3 ct Blue Yonder. These are all top notch distance casting reels.
Poles.....I agree that a 10' pole is probably going to work better than a bulky 12'. Lamiglass poles are realy good, and also slow to the scene are the inline poles, which are guidless. Daiwa makes one that I own which is actualy almost rifled inside and helps to shoot the line out.
all in all it is form and technique, I practice at the local high school field or at the beach when I can over the winter,(depends on the wheather), we can all improve casting form. Practice, practice, practice!!!!
Line....Berkley trilene XL for mainline and usualy berkley big game for my leader 30-50 # test twice the length of the pole!!! Thats right twice the length of the pole and enough to fit around the reel like 2-3 times (no snap offs!!! and you can realy, realy load the rod). Also many people do not establish a long enogh drop length to load the pole.
For distance casting your shock leader should be 10x the lure or sinker weight, ie 2oz lure= 20# leader (minimum) 3oz = 30# test leader etc....
There is just to much good stuff about fishing to talk about, (and buy!!!) lol!!!
Tight lines,
Mike
 

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I think you're right Skipjack. Let me add my two cents worth. Some time back a friend and I spent the night fishing Weekapug Beach in RI. We put a couple nice bass on the beach in the 30's. At first light we moved to the corner by the breachway and started banging blues on swimmers in close. Then it quit. ten minutes later blues started busting 90-100 yds.out. We switched to 4 OZ. Hopkins and 4 OZ. Roberts Big Shots. I was using a 10ft. custom rod made up on a Kennedy-Fisher graphite blank topped with a Daiwa 57H levelwind reel loaded 25# mono. The point is I had no trouble reaching those fish. My friend and I had the beach to ourselves and we caught fish til we got tired.On the way out the access road as we rounded the bluff the blues were working the bait in a school that stretched for more than a 100yds. What a day! Sorry for the fish story but it illustrates the point on levelwind reels. What I do like about the 57H is the fact that the levelwind disengages on the cast.
 

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I think you're right Skipjack. Let me add my two cents worth. Some time back a friend and I spent the night fishing Weekapug Beach in RI. We put a couple nice bass on the beach in the 30's. At first light we moved to the corner by the breachway and started banging blues on swimmers in close. Then it quit. ten minutes later blues started busting 90-100 yds.out. We switched to 4 OZ. Hopkins and 4 OZ. Roberts Big Shots. I was using a 10ft. custom rod made up on a Kennedy-Fisher graphite blank topped with a Daiwa 57H levelwind reel loaded 25# mono. The point is I had no trouble reaching those fish. My friend and I had the beach to ourselves and we caught fish til we got tired.On the way out the access road as we rounded the bluff the blues were working the bait in a school that stretched for more than a 100yds. What a day! Sorry for the fish story but it illustrates the point on levelwind reels. What I do like about the 57H is the fact that the levelwind disengages on the cast.
 

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i must say after reading these relys that i can't offer much more.but when I started out fishing many moons ago {spin} then turned to conv.99% for everything and being a rod builder{27yrs} for fun +profit the RIGHT rod blank/reel/line combo can make a BIG differance in how one gets his or her offering's out to where the fish are.NOTE that bunkerdunker has a very good rod blank and not one as i call it off the rack one.NOTE also that his l/wind disengages this to is a very good thing.I have a older abu magxl that does the very same thing.It will out cast my newer abu's with reg l/wind. 150yrds-3oz.-10'graphite-17#line no shock leader. my point is buy the very best you can. with practice and better gear those long casts will come.[fish finder] and oh one more thing shoot for the moon with that lead/not a line drive to the horrizon when useing conv. capesams
 

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A rod you might want to consider is the 10'Penn Big Game Spin Fisher (baitcasting). It's got a soft tip that's easy to load, though it can be a little sluggish when throwing 6 oz sinkers and bunker chunk.

I've got the Penn rod teamed with an ABU 7000 C3 (levelwind) and have no problem getting 2 to 3 oz lures out past the breakers. I think what ever the levelwind takes away it gives back with a smoother more carefree retrieve (a good thing in a blitz).

Tight Lines

AtomAnt
 
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