I am thinking about buying a Gussa Wahoo Jr composite or a Calstar 700XH and Saltist 40. I will spool it with 80 lb braid and 80 lb mono topshot. I plan on using it primarly for partyboat tuna. Any thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Jigging Combo For Tuna
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Sounds like they would both be good set ups- you will probably be instructed to add Carbontex washers to the Saltist to make it a bit smoother, otherwise you should be good to go- I have a 700H with a Saltiga 40 on it and love it. The GUSA rods have been getting rave reviews as well.
My 700XH weighs about 21 oz and the completed GUSA Wahoo Jr weighs about 17 - 18 oz. Wahoo Jr blank's weighs 7 oz. Both are fast action rod and Wahoo Jr's tip section is much flexible amd softer.
Both are fine for tuna jigging. I had my 700XH built for targeting big tuna in 150 - 200 lbs range. I feel even 700H is good enough for average tuna we catch on tuna party boats.
8'GUSA Wahoo and composite GUSA Wahoo Jr are different. While GUSA Wahoo is graphite blank with parabolic bend, the composite GUSA Wahoo Jr has soft fast action. When I checked GUSA Wahoo and composite GUSA Wahoo Jr blank I noticed that GUSA Wahoo's tip is a little thick, but GUSA Wahoo Jr is thicker at butt section.
Both are fine for tuna jigging. I had my 700XH built for targeting big tuna in 150 - 200 lbs range. I feel even 700H is good enough for average tuna we catch on tuna party boats.
8'GUSA Wahoo and composite GUSA Wahoo Jr are different. While GUSA Wahoo is graphite blank with parabolic bend, the composite GUSA Wahoo Jr has soft fast action. When I checked GUSA Wahoo and composite GUSA Wahoo Jr blank I noticed that GUSA Wahoo's tip is a little thick, but GUSA Wahoo Jr is thicker at butt section.
KILSONG wrote:
My 700XH weighs about 21 oz and the completed GUSA Wahoo Jr weighs about 17 - 18 oz. Wahoo Jr blank's weighs 7 oz. Both are fast action rod and Wahoo Jr's tip section is much flexible amd softer.
Both are fine for tuna jigging. I had my 700XH built for targeting big tuna in 150 - 200 lbs range. I feel even 700H is good enough for average tuna we catch on tuna party boats.
8'GUSA Wahoo and composite GUSA Wahoo Jr are different. While GUSA Wahoo is graphite blank with parabolic bend, the composite GUSA Wahoo Jr has soft fast action. When I checked GUSA Wahoo and composite GUSA Wahoo Jr blank I noticed that GUSA Wahoo's tip is a little thick, but GUSA Wahoo Jr is thicker at butt section. Kil. when we were designing the Wahoo JR,
there had to be a little material added to the butt to keep the same action as the 8' WAHOO.
that is what i was told during the design of the blank
and i am very happy with the action of the Wahoo JR
My 700XH weighs about 21 oz and the completed GUSA Wahoo Jr weighs about 17 - 18 oz. Wahoo Jr blank's weighs 7 oz. Both are fast action rod and Wahoo Jr's tip section is much flexible amd softer.
Both are fine for tuna jigging. I had my 700XH built for targeting big tuna in 150 - 200 lbs range. I feel even 700H is good enough for average tuna we catch on tuna party boats.
8'GUSA Wahoo and composite GUSA Wahoo Jr are different. While GUSA Wahoo is graphite blank with parabolic bend, the composite GUSA Wahoo Jr has soft fast action. When I checked GUSA Wahoo and composite GUSA Wahoo Jr blank I noticed that GUSA Wahoo's tip is a little thick, but GUSA Wahoo Jr is thicker at butt section. Kil. when we were designing the Wahoo JR,
there had to be a little material added to the butt to keep the same action as the 8' WAHOO.
that is what i was told during the design of the blank
and i am very happy with the action of the Wahoo JR
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KILSONG wrote:
My 700XH weighs about 21 oz and the completed GUSA Wahoo Jr weighs about 17 - 18 oz. Wahoo Jr blank's weighs 7 oz.
Kil, here are blank weights of several blanks (I didn't weigh the Calstars myself, only the GUSA's)
Calstar 700M = 7.8oz
Calstar 700H = 9.6
Calstar 700XH = 9.7
GUSA 7' Wahoo Jr Graphite = 6oz
GUSA 8' Wahoo Graphite = 8oz
GUSA 7' Wahoo Jr Composite = 7.8oz
The finished weights of rods will vary from builder to builder, and teh materials used to construct teh rod. For example, I have 2 70 MEga Composites wrapped in my shop, both using the same materials, excpet one has Hypalon, grips, teh other has EVA. One rod weighs 11.3oz, the other is 13.5oz.
My 700XH weighs about 21 oz and the completed GUSA Wahoo Jr weighs about 17 - 18 oz. Wahoo Jr blank's weighs 7 oz.
Kil, here are blank weights of several blanks (I didn't weigh the Calstars myself, only the GUSA's)
Calstar 700M = 7.8oz
Calstar 700H = 9.6
Calstar 700XH = 9.7
GUSA 7' Wahoo Jr Graphite = 6oz
GUSA 8' Wahoo Graphite = 8oz
GUSA 7' Wahoo Jr Composite = 7.8oz
The finished weights of rods will vary from builder to builder, and teh materials used to construct teh rod. For example, I have 2 70 MEga Composites wrapped in my shop, both using the same materials, excpet one has Hypalon, grips, teh other has EVA. One rod weighs 11.3oz, the other is 13.5oz.
Folks,
As a 360 regular, I have been visiting this most excellent board for some time and have decided to weigh in from time to time here as well. You will find that I request a lot more information than I give.
paul708 wrote:
As a 360 regular, I have been visiting this most excellent board for some time and have decided to weigh in from time to time here as well. You will find that I request a lot more information than I give.
paul708 wrote:
KILSONG said:I had my 700XH built for targeting big tuna in 150 - 200 lbs range. I feel even 700H is good enough for average tuna we catch on tuna party boats.
Kil:
I believe I have cured myself of fishing bait 95 percent of the time. On previous trips, I have justified this by saying that I needed to take home tuna for my family. However, now that I have seen myself outfished by jigging and popping, I am becoming a believer.![]()
I think, having read many of your posts and having talked to and watched you and Angelo on the July 3-6 trip, jigging with rods in the 7-7 1/2 foot range, and given your success rate with tuna at depths up to 100 feet, I am planning to change my jigging outfit for the Gulf of Mexico to the following:
Rod: Calstar 700H conventional--this rod has a graphite reel seat and weighs, I believe, about 19 ounces. I like the way you use the rail, even while jigging, and I would probably add a few inches of cold shrink to the grip for this purpose.
Reel: 665W 2-speed (not ideal for jigging due to width, but I seem to be OK laying line back on.)
Line: YKG Jigman 80 pound/25 foot fluoro topshot joined by loop to loop.
I would plan to use this setup, using primarily hammered diamond jigs for all yellowfin and for grouper fishing.
My plan is to use the Smith Nirai and either a 20,000 or 8,000 sized Stella or Accurate with long Williamson Benthos jigs for big AJ s.
I would welcome your (or anyone else's) comments on this setup.
Russ
This post edited by UncleRuss 01:24 PM 07/17/2008
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jigging
The 700H is a nice rod --- but that style of jigging for tuna is over --- short light stick and reel is the way to go.
The focus is jigging --- a 665W 2 speed --- why??? The idea is to make the process as effortless as possible --- why not use a reel designed for jigging?
This post edited by BobWheeler 04:20 PM 07/18/2008
The 700H is a nice rod --- but that style of jigging for tuna is over --- short light stick and reel is the way to go.
The focus is jigging --- a 665W 2 speed --- why??? The idea is to make the process as effortless as possible --- why not use a reel designed for jigging?
This post edited by BobWheeler 04:20 PM 07/18/2008
Russ,
Welcome aboard.
![]()
When I fished with you on the Big E, I concentrated on jigging on the second night as popping areas were very crowded and wanted to catch yellowfin. It's been frustrating to catch yellowfin among so many blackfin whenever I fished in the Gulf of Mexico.
My strategy was simple. Consentrating near top as yellowfin were feeding flyfish on top. I noticed that most guys who jigged on the boat fished on the side where current were going out. I believe they mostly jigged Japanese style with short rods. I tried to slow down my jigging motion on the other side as blackfin or smaller yellowfin tuna love fast moving jigs. On the second day, I landed two decent size yellowfin and lost two bigger ones on jigs while nobody landed a decent size yellowfin among jig fishermen ( I guess there were about 5 - 10 jig fisdermen who jiggied all night.). I found that yellowfin hit slow moving jigs and fast moving jigs. Which one is better ? It depends on situations.
I experimented both techniques intensively for several years and sometime Japanese style jigging worked better,and sometimes conventional up and down jigging dominated.
I found tuna stay away from boat lights cruising around the boat outskirt of boats light. That is one reason popping is so effective there by casting far. I did the same tactic. I casted as far as I can and start jigging immediately or after waiting a few seconds. When my jig comes to the boat and drift down to the other side of the boat,I cast again. I had two hit when my jig was sinking after casting. Only one time I had a hig when my jig was under the boat, probably less than 100 ft. And also I had a hit when I jigged pretty fast using Japanese style jigging.
I feel slow up-and-down jigging is more preferred to fast cranking Japanese style jigging to catch yellowfin among so many blackfin in the Gulf of Mexico. To do this, you need 7 - 8 ft long rod as East Coast fishermen do. Casting is very important part of jigging on the East Coast.
700H
Clastar 700H is excellent rod. One gentleman who is a regular on the Big E used custom made spinning 700H next to me on the June Big E trip and I was surprised he could cast quiet far with 7' rod.
Accurate 665W
You can use the reel for jigging, but I suggest to use other reels as I believe you own lots of reels. Regular 665 have enough line capacity for any tuna under 300 lbs and you don't need 665W for tuna jigging. The narrower, the better for jigging as far as line capacity is not an issue.
I still prefer star drag reels for jigging.
lines
80 lbs braided line and 20 ft leader line with loop to loop connection is fine. How do you use loop to loop connection as YGK PE lines are not hollowed ?
I met another fisherman on the June Big E trip and he e-mailed me that he had a great success with hammered diamond jigs for grouper, snapper and AJ on his recent Big E trip. Hammered diamond jigs are proven jigs for various species, but you recommend to use other proven jigs too as everyday is differnt. Even slight change of color of the same jigs sometimes make a difference. When I have to catch tuna, I seldom use hammered diamond jig.
This post edited by KILSONG 10:09 PM 07/18/2008
Welcome aboard.
When I fished with you on the Big E, I concentrated on jigging on the second night as popping areas were very crowded and wanted to catch yellowfin. It's been frustrating to catch yellowfin among so many blackfin whenever I fished in the Gulf of Mexico.
My strategy was simple. Consentrating near top as yellowfin were feeding flyfish on top. I noticed that most guys who jigged on the boat fished on the side where current were going out. I believe they mostly jigged Japanese style with short rods. I tried to slow down my jigging motion on the other side as blackfin or smaller yellowfin tuna love fast moving jigs. On the second day, I landed two decent size yellowfin and lost two bigger ones on jigs while nobody landed a decent size yellowfin among jig fishermen ( I guess there were about 5 - 10 jig fisdermen who jiggied all night.). I found that yellowfin hit slow moving jigs and fast moving jigs. Which one is better ? It depends on situations.
I experimented both techniques intensively for several years and sometime Japanese style jigging worked better,and sometimes conventional up and down jigging dominated.
I found tuna stay away from boat lights cruising around the boat outskirt of boats light. That is one reason popping is so effective there by casting far. I did the same tactic. I casted as far as I can and start jigging immediately or after waiting a few seconds. When my jig comes to the boat and drift down to the other side of the boat,I cast again. I had two hit when my jig was sinking after casting. Only one time I had a hig when my jig was under the boat, probably less than 100 ft. And also I had a hit when I jigged pretty fast using Japanese style jigging.
I feel slow up-and-down jigging is more preferred to fast cranking Japanese style jigging to catch yellowfin among so many blackfin in the Gulf of Mexico. To do this, you need 7 - 8 ft long rod as East Coast fishermen do. Casting is very important part of jigging on the East Coast.
700H
Clastar 700H is excellent rod. One gentleman who is a regular on the Big E used custom made spinning 700H next to me on the June Big E trip and I was surprised he could cast quiet far with 7' rod.
Accurate 665W
You can use the reel for jigging, but I suggest to use other reels as I believe you own lots of reels.
Regular 665 have enough line capacity for any tuna under 300 lbs and you don't need 665W for tuna jigging. The narrower, the better for jigging as far as line capacity is not an issue. I still prefer star drag reels for jigging.
lines
80 lbs braided line and 20 ft leader line with loop to loop connection is fine. How do you use loop to loop connection as YGK PE lines are not hollowed ?
I met another fisherman on the June Big E trip and he e-mailed me that he had a great success with hammered diamond jigs for grouper, snapper and AJ on his recent Big E trip. Hammered diamond jigs are proven jigs for various species, but you recommend to use other proven jigs too as everyday is differnt. Even slight change of color of the same jigs sometimes make a difference. When I have to catch tuna, I seldom use hammered diamond jig.
This post edited by KILSONG 10:09 PM 07/18/2008
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I too was surprised that he (Charlie) could cast so far with that rod. I am thinking about having a 7' rod or so built for slower jigging but am thinking about making it 2 piece because of the airline restrictions now.
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product feedback
i've got some experience with all the products in question. for whatever its worth, here are a few observations.
i don't mean to slam products, but the failure rate of ygk ultra jigman is unacceptable. at best, the line is unreliable and at worst, its all junk. do some trolling through old posts here, and you'll find multiple reports of breakoffs just after hookup.
in contrast, Sun Line Deep One has extremely low failure rates, is easy to knot, and holds up over time. just google peace token tackle and you can order it online. japantackle.com sometimes has it as well. perhaps other fishermen can give you you feedback on alternative metered braid products on the market (e.g. from OTI and daiwa).
as an owner of the 665 and avid jig fisherman, I'd echo Kil's advice and point toward a star drag reel. star drags are so much easier for this style of fishing. ocea jigger is the deluxe option (wish i had one!), but an upgraded saltist would do you just as well.
the 700h is a great rod- perfect for the size fish we get up here in the n/e canyons. but if there are lots of fish above 100lbs, you might consider a move to the 700xh. the 700h gets maxed out on bigger fish. you can land big fish on the 700h, but it might be easier with a rod with more backbone. and at the risk of opening a can of worms, the GUSA sticks are lighter and extremely powerful.
i've got some experience with all the products in question. for whatever its worth, here are a few observations.
i don't mean to slam products, but the failure rate of ygk ultra jigman is unacceptable. at best, the line is unreliable and at worst, its all junk. do some trolling through old posts here, and you'll find multiple reports of breakoffs just after hookup.
in contrast, Sun Line Deep One has extremely low failure rates, is easy to knot, and holds up over time. just google peace token tackle and you can order it online. japantackle.com sometimes has it as well. perhaps other fishermen can give you you feedback on alternative metered braid products on the market (e.g. from OTI and daiwa).
as an owner of the 665 and avid jig fisherman, I'd echo Kil's advice and point toward a star drag reel. star drags are so much easier for this style of fishing. ocea jigger is the deluxe option (wish i had one!), but an upgraded saltist would do you just as well.
the 700h is a great rod- perfect for the size fish we get up here in the n/e canyons. but if there are lots of fish above 100lbs, you might consider a move to the 700xh. the 700h gets maxed out on bigger fish. you can land big fish on the 700h, but it might be easier with a rod with more backbone. and at the risk of opening a can of worms, the GUSA sticks are lighter and extremely powerful.
Paul: Thanks for your feedback. Information from you on rods, especially, is always welcome.
Kil: Thanks very much for your long, and informative post. As you know, we have talked many times in the past, and you have been very helpful each time. I often wish I had taken your advice on a narrower reel?and possibly even a star drag. The answer to your question on loop-to-loop is quite simply that I tie a 50 turn Bimini in the YKG and loop to that. I figure that, with a 70 percent strength in braid, the Bimini will hold to nearly 60 pounds in 80 pound line.
Come to think of it, I do not believe I have ever asked you what brand of line you prefer for jigging.
I was extremely impressed, watching your method on the Big E?for the following reasons: First, it seemed you were able to conserve a lot of energy. I feel that deep vertical jigging fast with a short rod and heavy jig are very tiring?and I will be honest with you?if I had to do that all night long, I simply would not jig at all. I would do popping and bait fishing only! Second, it appeared that you were able to conserve even more energy by using the rail on the slow vertical lift. Third, and most important, you caught yellowfin?while most of the short, fast jiggers caught blackfin--just as I have in the past. So I intend to use the short rod and fast style only for amberjack, in the future.
You probably don't remember, but you originally advised me to buy the narrower reels for jigging and I should have, but I did not?for now that is all I have except for spinners, but will likely buy a narrower, more appropriate reel for that use--maybe even an Ocean Jigger. What I do like is the low gear for cranking up fish at the end of the fight.
Bret: I have the 700H and 700XH in spinners and I am not able to cast nearly as far as I can with the 80P/35 or 9 foot Souls?but I am limited in casting ability.
Dhoperos: I have heard some bad things about the line as well?but only after I bought a lot of it. I will say that I have tested it extensively using a spring scale, as well as shock loading it by jerking and have not experienced problems. (On the other hand, I realize that is not the same as experience fishing with the line, and I have not put it through very serious testing on the water.) Thanks for the advice on other products.
Russ
Kil: Thanks very much for your long, and informative post. As you know, we have talked many times in the past, and you have been very helpful each time. I often wish I had taken your advice on a narrower reel?and possibly even a star drag. The answer to your question on loop-to-loop is quite simply that I tie a 50 turn Bimini in the YKG and loop to that. I figure that, with a 70 percent strength in braid, the Bimini will hold to nearly 60 pounds in 80 pound line.
Come to think of it, I do not believe I have ever asked you what brand of line you prefer for jigging.
I was extremely impressed, watching your method on the Big E?for the following reasons: First, it seemed you were able to conserve a lot of energy. I feel that deep vertical jigging fast with a short rod and heavy jig are very tiring?and I will be honest with you?if I had to do that all night long, I simply would not jig at all. I would do popping and bait fishing only! Second, it appeared that you were able to conserve even more energy by using the rail on the slow vertical lift. Third, and most important, you caught yellowfin?while most of the short, fast jiggers caught blackfin--just as I have in the past. So I intend to use the short rod and fast style only for amberjack, in the future.
You probably don't remember, but you originally advised me to buy the narrower reels for jigging and I should have, but I did not?for now that is all I have except for spinners, but will likely buy a narrower, more appropriate reel for that use--maybe even an Ocean Jigger. What I do like is the low gear for cranking up fish at the end of the fight.
Bret: I have the 700H and 700XH in spinners and I am not able to cast nearly as far as I can with the 80P/35 or 9 foot Souls?but I am limited in casting ability.
Dhoperos: I have heard some bad things about the line as well?but only after I bought a lot of it.
I will say that I have tested it extensively using a spring scale, as well as shock loading it by jerking and have not experienced problems. (On the other hand, I realize that is not the same as experience fishing with the line, and I have not put it through very serious testing on the water.) Thanks for the advice on other products.Russ
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