NorEast Fishing Forum banner
1 - 20 of 24 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,708 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
With all the drastic proposals on the table regarding our local fisheries (ie.,2 Fluke, 10 Scup, 4 Tog) I ask this question: At what point would you cut back on trips/sell your boat or (in the case of the CB/PB capts. out there) sail only on weekends/get out of the business?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
74,095 Posts
Charter Captain wins the lottery. At the press conference they ask him what he's going to do now that he's a millionaire. Capt. replies "keep fishing until the money runs out!"

Anyone who was in the business soley for the money left about four years ago!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,708 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
MakoMike wrote:
Anyone who was in the business soley for the money left about four years ago!



Yeah, Im sure all the boats that spend money on advertising here are in it for the fun of it. I guess their trust funds must have kicked in 4 years ago.......:rolleyes:
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
74,095 Posts
MisterX wrote:
MakoMike wrote:
Anyone who was in the business soley for the money left about four years ago!



Yeah, Im sure all the boats that spend money on advertising here are in it for the fun of it. I guess their trust funds must have kicked in 4 years ago.......:rolleyes:



No, they spend money here because they are trying to stay in business. But they are trying to stay in business because of more than just the money. If the money was all they cared about they would be doing something else.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
855 Posts
MisterX wrote:
With all the drastic proposals on the table regarding our local fisheries (ie.,2 Fluke, 10 Scup, 4 Tog) I ask this question: At what point would you cut back on trips/sell your boat or (in the case of the CB/PB capts. out there) sail only on weekends/get out of the business?



My tipping point with fluke all ready passed a year and a half ago. 10 Scup/4 Tog should just about close down my bottom fishing. Bluefishing on the Brooklyn (and other fine bluefishing PBs)-here I come, get those jigs and gaffs ready!

This post edited by Seajay2 10:53 AM 02/01/2008
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,031 Posts
Maybe in your world Mike.....

MakoMike wrote:
MisterX wrote:
MakoMike wrote:
Anyone who was in the business soley for the money left about four years ago!

Yeah, Im sure all the boats that spend money on advertising here are in it for the fun of it. I guess their trust funds must have kicked in 4 years ago.......:rolleyes:

No, they spend money here because they are trying to stay in business. But they are trying to stay in business because of more than just the money. If the money was all they cared about they would be doing something else.

I'd imagine there are more than a few guys who advertise here who would take serious exception with this.

In fact I know that many of the advertisers here actually are looking for somewhere more relevant to advertise , due to this very sentiment amongst some of the folks here at NE.;)
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
74,095 Posts
loligo wrote:
In fact I know that many of the advertisers here actually are looking for somewhere more relevant to advertise , due to this very sentiment amongst some of the folks here at NE.;)

Did a little birdy tell you that or did you get out your crystal ball? You must has used either while you were sitting in the can, because that is a load of crap!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
25 Posts
Why I advertise here

I hope to pick up a few charters from those surfing this web site, but a great majority of my clients come by word of mouth because I always work hard, and treat them right. The fluke regs are beyond frustrating, so I just look at it as I'm not going to get any charters until striped bass fishing lights up in June. I just keep plugging along hoping things will get better, but the future certainly is not bright. Just keeping a boat in the water, and winter storage puts me about 8-grand in the hole. If things continue charter and party boats will be a thing of the past, and with it will go another historic Long Island tradition. Nobody seems to give a ****, especially the tree huggers who are funding the fight against regulatory extensions for the Magnuson Act. By the way anybody read last months SPORTFISHING Magazine? That editor wrote a sarcastic column basically saying we are wrong to be asking for extensions like the Party boat guys in New Jersey are now doing for fluke. Well I think its time to cancel my subscription.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
63 Posts
tip

For me, that tipping point starting in 1978 when I had my last good codifsh trip out of NJ. Have not done more than a handful of trips since and totally stopped cod fishing out of NJ after many many trips for just one or two when my 8 pounder won the pool. What a joke. Whiting tipping point was early 1990s after the nth trip for just a few spikes. Flounder tipping point was late 80s after I realized I just could not catch flounders without tons of chum and lots of moving around - almost not worth it. Not even close to previous decades. Today I spend $0 annually on these species (though I do toy with the idea of a MTK or Helen H type trip) You know? It had nothing to do with REGs and everything to do with NO FISH. I still have a boat. I'd love to bring more fish home, but thats not why I have a boat.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
686 Posts
Folks in Green Harbor must know something the rest don't

quote:

MakoMike wrote:

Anyone who was in the business soley for the money left about four years ago!

I don't know, Mike. It was only a couple years ago that there was a charter captain describing to the Council that he was looking to add yet another $300,000 boat to his fleet. A total of three such vessels, as I recall.

He happened to be on the NEFMC Recreational Advisory Panel too, btw.

Like all businesses, some do well and some don't.

Maybe that old addage also holds true in the charter industry whereby 90% of the money is earned by 10% of the participants.

Mike F.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
74,095 Posts
flatts1b wrote:
quote:

MakoMike wrote:

Anyone who was in the business soley for the money left about four years ago!

I don't know, Mike. It was only a couple years ago that there was a charter captain describing to the Council that he was looking to add yet another $300,000 boat to his fleet. A total of three such vessels, as I recall.

He happened to be on the NEFMC Recreational Advisory Panel too, btw.

Like all businesses, some do well and some don't.

Maybe that old addage also holds true in the charter industry whereby 90% of the money is earned by 10% of the participants.

Mike F.

I haven't audited his books, but from what Tom tells me he does have a good business going. But I think he is the exception rather than the rule. Besides we were talking about charter boats in the NY/NJ area. Up where Tom is located they can still book charters for cod and BFT.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
63 Posts
tip

Charter Business in NY/NJ is a difficult thing to define. You have real captains who do this all year, you have guys (hobby) who dabble in it, you have some guys that commercial fish (pin hook, some more often than not) and others who seem to be pure captains working for customers.

Can anyone give me an insider's breakdown on how this might look in terms of numbers?

At the marina I was at this past yr in Montauk I noticed something odd - one of the big name captains didnt seem to be leaving the dock as much as I thought he would - and he certainly wasn't going as much as others. I did a little math in my head and figured there was no way he would remian solvent if chartering was his sole source of income. He would have folded (I certainly would have!) Ok, he'd come back sometimes and I'd see he was pin hooking and thus he was under a whole different set of regs for at least those trips. But even here I don't thing his pin hooking trips amounted to much after backing out gas and other expenses. And this was supposedly a big name sought-after captain. It was only then that I realized how complicated this all gets.

This post edited by John_ny1 04:32 PM 02/02/2008
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
74,095 Posts
John_ny1 wrote:
Charter Business in NY/NJ is a difficult thing to define. You have real captains who do this all year, you have guys (hobby) who dabble in it, you have some guys that commercial fish (pin hook, some more often than not) and others who seem to be pure captains working for customers.

Can anyone give me an insider's breakdown on how this might look in terms of numbers?

At the marina I was at this past yr in Montauk I noticed something odd - one of the big name captains didnt seem to be leaving the dock as much as I thought he would - and he certainly wasn't going as much as others. I did a little math in my head and figured there was no way he would remian solvent if chartering was his sole source of income. He would have folded (I certainly would have!) Ok, he'd come back sometimes and I'd see he was pin hooking and thus he was under a whole different set of regs for at least those trips. But even here I don't thing his pin hooking trips amounted to much after backing out gas and other expenses. And this was supposedly a big name sought-after captain. It was only then that I realized how complicated this all gets.

Almost all of the Montauk charter boats pinhook when they don't have a charter and the fish are around. What marina were you at?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,708 Posts
Discussion Starter · #14 ·
MakoMike wrote:
Almost all of the Montauk charter boats pinhook when they don't have a charter and the fish are around

With the exception of bass, there aint much pinhooking going on these days in Montauk.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,444 Posts
The Money

You cant be in this business soley for the money?

You do need to make money to stay in the business

Simple fact is advertising must produce more than you spend on it if it dosnet you dump the advertising and find a venue for your add dollars.

This business has been changing and will continue to change for quite some time to come . Simple fact is those fisherman and those boats that are in it just for the $$ or the catching of fish will both fall by the wayside .
Those fisherman that are in the sport for all it has to offer in the way of a great family outdoor activty will remain . As will those operations that cater to them .

Guys just remember nothing is as it was, no wild resouces is as plentyfull no natural enviroment as pristene . But old and yong still enjoy the out doors .

Personally i dont mind hearing that things are not as good as they once were . But the worst thing especially on a fishing site is beating that horse to death .
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,064 Posts
gslamcharter wrote:
By the way anybody read last months SPORTFISHING Magazine? That editor wrote a sarcastic column basically saying we are wrong to be asking for extensions like the Party boat guys in New Jersey are now doing for fluke. Well I think its time to cancel my subscription.


I noticed that editorial and given the junk that guy usually writes I was not suprised to see him write something bogus like that. That guy just does not get it. Not sure why I bother reading that mag, it sucks.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
25 Posts
regarding Sport Fishing Magazine

I just found my renewal card for Sport Fishing, and like I alluded too earlier it just went into the garbage. Also responded to his editorial on the web site we'll see what the response is.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
25 Posts
Real Captain or Dabble

Well I consider myself a "Real" Captain who fishes full time from May to December, whether all here agree thats their opinion. I can't see keeping a boat in the water at Montauk all winter for a limited amount of charters. I assume those that do make a buck, but dodging weather patterns makes it tough, but if the cod ever come back big time then we'll see.

Contrary too belief not all Montauk Captains are pinhookers, I am not, and getting into it now the way the DEC manages it is extremely difficult, and forget about bass tags, right or wrong they are treated as if they are the crown jewels. MY opinion here is fluid, I believe protecting the resource is vital, but at the same time if the resource is managed correctly, and a proper amount of fish can be removed for a profit then that is fine.

Bottom line when the weather is right, and the fish bite, I have the greatest office in the world, and I appreciate this. I did something else for 20 years that I never really enjoyed, so I paid my dues. I know I could make more money in another profession, but I intend to stick this out, and hope things change for the better.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
63 Posts
tip

Mako Mike I'd rather not get into specifics on the web - crazy world out there, guys have had boats vandalized for speaking out - Then again not sure what specifics are needed, but pls PM me if you really need more.

But to make a point you do have boats like Herls Girl over at Star. I never see the guy advertise anywhere but he always seems to have a charter to take out. Other guys seem to advertise like crazy, but dont appear to sail as often.

re other point someone made - Pinhooking for bottom species like porgies still goes on. Nutin wrong with that. Its not just bass.

Really I have nothing wrong with any of this, but see first-hand its not as simple as more regs = tipping point = out of business. What I can see the charter industry is a complicated mix of real captains competing against part-timers/weekenders, chartering vs pinhooking, and a very big difference between how some guys run their boats (which equates to more return business for some) so the laws of economics don't really work here like they do in other businesses.

Just my 2 cents anyway-

This post edited by John_ny1 12:47 PM 02/03/2008
 
1 - 20 of 24 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top