Wondering how many other commercial fisherman monitor this website for bogus reports against commercial fisherman. Its very sad that the recreational fisherman can't respect that some Americans chose to fish for a living. Fishing is one oldest professions in America and its a very tough living with todays rules and regs. Yeah I know I could give it up and do something else but thats not the issue here. The issue here is recreational fisherman making false statements in some of the posted reports and giving us another black eye.
Commercial Bashing
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yea i work on a 6pac boat and long liners and there are a couple of false comments about fisherman on this boat. now i have almost equal respect for fish as i do humans but its are way of life that we depend on to live and raise a family and they give us the regulations and we keep as much as we can to survive, i understand how some recreational fisherman can hate us because of rumors they hear of what we do but please give us some slack.But i have no hard feelings here.
Tight lines men
Tight lines men
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252 Posts
The simple fact of the matter is fisheries are in decline every where. Restrictions need to be in place to help fisheries return to healthy levels, and healthy does not mean one step above extinction. As a recreational angler I will gladly live with less to achieve this goal. As a commercial fisherman you should understand that when the fishing is gone so is your livelihood.
Own a boat, love to fish, eat lots of fish, BUT....................
I bet 50% of the fish I eat is bought @ the Fish Market for couple reasons.
1, aint the greatest fisherman, just enjoy being on the water and dont like to rape the sea.
2, Love Salmon,Pampano, Mahi Mahi and many other fish that arent caught in our waters.
So I need you guys!
Keep up the good work and stay safe, Its one of the more dangerous jobs in the world if I remember right.
Also who supplys the skimmer clams, eels and bunker for the recreational anglers to use as bait? Why it's the commericals.
You guys are also fun to get drunk with as Ive been known to frequent a Poop Deck or 2,
So, Salute!
Alan
I bet 50% of the fish I eat is bought @ the Fish Market for couple reasons.
1, aint the greatest fisherman, just enjoy being on the water and dont like to rape the sea.
2, Love Salmon,Pampano, Mahi Mahi and many other fish that arent caught in our waters.
So I need you guys!
Keep up the good work and stay safe, Its one of the more dangerous jobs in the world if I remember right.
Also who supplys the skimmer clams, eels and bunker for the recreational anglers to use as bait? Why it's the commericals.
You guys are also fun to get drunk with as Ive been known to frequent a Poop Deck or 2,
So, Salute!
Alan
I think one of the biggest problems I have with commercials are the by-catch that is just tossed overboard.....
My grandfather lives in Florida, on a canal that is about 250 feet from the Gulf of Mexico. Every other day the 2 local shrimp boats go out for their catch. When they come back, they don't just throw out what they aren't going to use... People down there actually sit out on their docks waiting for them to come back (between 5&6pm). The shrimpers (Don't know their technical name) give by-catch to the people that live on the canal.
Every man deserves to make a living, if it's catching fish for a living, so be it. It just aggravates the **** out of me to see commercials dump what they don't want overboard....
Eventually, the enviromentalists (They always find a way to win in the end! **** democrats!) will get a law that will ban trawlers, gill nets, etc., and limit commercials to pin-hooking only.... How nice would that be?
My grandfather lives in Florida, on a canal that is about 250 feet from the Gulf of Mexico. Every other day the 2 local shrimp boats go out for their catch. When they come back, they don't just throw out what they aren't going to use... People down there actually sit out on their docks waiting for them to come back (between 5&6pm). The shrimpers (Don't know their technical name) give by-catch to the people that live on the canal.
Every man deserves to make a living, if it's catching fish for a living, so be it. It just aggravates the **** out of me to see commercials dump what they don't want overboard....
Eventually, the enviromentalists (They always find a way to win in the end! **** democrats!) will get a law that will ban trawlers, gill nets, etc., and limit commercials to pin-hooking only.... How nice would that be?
Most of the fish that are tossed overboard are edible. It hurts us just as much if not more than you guys to see perfectly good fish floating belly up. But when you can only keep 70lbs of Scup for one trip/day or 100 lbs of fluke per trip/day and your not even trying to catch these species at times what else can you do?????????? I agree it not right but its not by choice.
You are right..... I only know the basics about the commercial industry, it's just a shame that if you have your 100lbs. of Fluke, you have to throw back any others that put you over... Maybe they have to ammend the laws so that if you have 90lbs. and put out your next net and there's lets say 30lbs. of fish in there, you can keep that extra 20lbs. so it doesn't go to waste.
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11,904 Posts
Hello commercial fisherman.
There are a few other commercial guys on this board as well. I am not one of them. I can understand some of your anger Clamman, that has brought you to register today and immediately post this topic. I read your comment on the reports as well.
Lately it seems that whenever a commercial fishing boat is spotted in the area where a recreational fishing boat is, there is a general call for concern as to the legality of it. In the case of the greenport report you replied to, you say that it was a complete fabrication. That may be. I did not see one commercial fishing boat out there on Saturday.
The problem lies with the fact that recreational fisherman are the public utilizing a public resource and commercials are a private industry utilizing a public resource to profit from. So of course recs are critical of commercials when we see our public resources being depleted, and often only as by catch, in pusuit of the all mighty dollar.
Myself and many others realize that commercial fisherman have a place in this world. You provide a service to the nations population that cannot get out and fish and even to fisherman themselves (As Alan pointed out here and Bucktail on another thread). However, it also seems that there are too many commercial fisherman out there trying to scratch a living out of a dwindling resource by using more and more efficient technologies.
The decline of certain fisheries is only part of the problem though. When recreational's see programs like "Empty Oceans, Empty Nets", read the recent rash of reports of illegal poaching incedents, see all of the pot bouys out there and see first hand the effects of by catch (Last season there was a huge school of stripers dumped back outside of FI inlet), you guys get a bad rap. Many recs beleive that commercials would use any means necessary to catch every last fish from the oceans just to bring in that last dollar.
Not all commercial guys are to blame. Many of you are operating within your legal rights. When the recs realize this and they shift from attacking the commercials personally and then focus on trying to change the regs, the commercial guys take that personally as well. Then the recs are trying to overregulate, and take away the comms livelhood, which they take personally. So, everything becomes a personal attack.
Don't worry though. The recreational guys attack each other almost as vehemently. Look at the arguments between bait fisherman and pluggers, or fly fisherman and between those who brag about Catch and Release and those who brag about limiting out. As recs we are almost as divided internally as the recs from comms.
Bottom line is that the commercial fisherman are too good at what they do. Either by regulation or by loss of species commercial fisherman are going to be loosing some of their jobs, so that the rest can survive. I personally would rather see the regulations drive some out so that fish stocks would not have to dwindle to get the same effect.
On a side note for commercial fisherman, I saw an interesting video clip a few days ago that showed how a new squid net reduced by catch by over 90%. That is great and I would like to see more of this technology applied to other methods of fishing. But while by catch is reduced, overfishing is still a possibility.
As one species declines, another will take over as the preferred game. There was a time when lobsters were considered only for fertilzer, now they are harder to find. Dogfish used to be discarded as by catch and now the europeans eat them for "fish and chips" I am sure there will come a time when sea robins and skates are targeted as well.
I hope there will come a time when some kind of understanding between recs and comms can be reached, but I doubt it is likely. Good luck to all.
Chris
There are a few other commercial guys on this board as well. I am not one of them. I can understand some of your anger Clamman, that has brought you to register today and immediately post this topic. I read your comment on the reports as well.
Lately it seems that whenever a commercial fishing boat is spotted in the area where a recreational fishing boat is, there is a general call for concern as to the legality of it. In the case of the greenport report you replied to, you say that it was a complete fabrication. That may be. I did not see one commercial fishing boat out there on Saturday.
The problem lies with the fact that recreational fisherman are the public utilizing a public resource and commercials are a private industry utilizing a public resource to profit from. So of course recs are critical of commercials when we see our public resources being depleted, and often only as by catch, in pusuit of the all mighty dollar.
Myself and many others realize that commercial fisherman have a place in this world. You provide a service to the nations population that cannot get out and fish and even to fisherman themselves (As Alan pointed out here and Bucktail on another thread). However, it also seems that there are too many commercial fisherman out there trying to scratch a living out of a dwindling resource by using more and more efficient technologies.
The decline of certain fisheries is only part of the problem though. When recreational's see programs like "Empty Oceans, Empty Nets", read the recent rash of reports of illegal poaching incedents, see all of the pot bouys out there and see first hand the effects of by catch (Last season there was a huge school of stripers dumped back outside of FI inlet), you guys get a bad rap. Many recs beleive that commercials would use any means necessary to catch every last fish from the oceans just to bring in that last dollar.
Not all commercial guys are to blame. Many of you are operating within your legal rights. When the recs realize this and they shift from attacking the commercials personally and then focus on trying to change the regs, the commercial guys take that personally as well. Then the recs are trying to overregulate, and take away the comms livelhood, which they take personally. So, everything becomes a personal attack.
Don't worry though. The recreational guys attack each other almost as vehemently. Look at the arguments between bait fisherman and pluggers, or fly fisherman and between those who brag about Catch and Release and those who brag about limiting out. As recs we are almost as divided internally as the recs from comms.
Bottom line is that the commercial fisherman are too good at what they do. Either by regulation or by loss of species commercial fisherman are going to be loosing some of their jobs, so that the rest can survive. I personally would rather see the regulations drive some out so that fish stocks would not have to dwindle to get the same effect.
On a side note for commercial fisherman, I saw an interesting video clip a few days ago that showed how a new squid net reduced by catch by over 90%. That is great and I would like to see more of this technology applied to other methods of fishing. But while by catch is reduced, overfishing is still a possibility.
As one species declines, another will take over as the preferred game. There was a time when lobsters were considered only for fertilzer, now they are harder to find. Dogfish used to be discarded as by catch and now the europeans eat them for "fish and chips" I am sure there will come a time when sea robins and skates are targeted as well.
I hope there will come a time when some kind of understanding between recs and comms can be reached, but I doubt it is likely. Good luck to all.
Chris
Hello, guys;
An interesting discussion - Can I ask you Commercial guys a question?
Before I do tho, I am a recreational fisherman who may be a little biased against the Commercial guys, because of the wrongs I've seen going on in the Bay, guys netting up fish at night, and not even caring if they get fines, because the profits so heavily outweigh them. I have no gripe against legitimate Commercial fishing, and the by-catch issue is unfortunate, and I know the legit fisherman and regulators are doing everything possible to battle it.
I would just like to ask that if you Commercial Fisherman see, or know of, a fellow Fisherman is performing illegal activities, do you report him or advise him to refrain from this, as we Recreational Fisherman do? Speaking for myself, I believe we need to watch over our sport and promply report any outright illegal activity amongst our recreational peers. I am wondering how the Commercial brethren address this problem amongst themselves. I have never heard of one Commercial Fisherman "ratting" another one out, as it were, and I ask this not to be critical - just curious as to how this is addressed. It is a matter of regulating each other for the good of the whole, as I see it. We recreational guys do it, being more aware than ever for the need for it. Do you Commercial guys do the same?
An interesting discussion - Can I ask you Commercial guys a question?
Before I do tho, I am a recreational fisherman who may be a little biased against the Commercial guys, because of the wrongs I've seen going on in the Bay, guys netting up fish at night, and not even caring if they get fines, because the profits so heavily outweigh them. I have no gripe against legitimate Commercial fishing, and the by-catch issue is unfortunate, and I know the legit fisherman and regulators are doing everything possible to battle it.
I would just like to ask that if you Commercial Fisherman see, or know of, a fellow Fisherman is performing illegal activities, do you report him or advise him to refrain from this, as we Recreational Fisherman do? Speaking for myself, I believe we need to watch over our sport and promply report any outright illegal activity amongst our recreational peers. I am wondering how the Commercial brethren address this problem amongst themselves. I have never heard of one Commercial Fisherman "ratting" another one out, as it were, and I ask this not to be critical - just curious as to how this is addressed. It is a matter of regulating each other for the good of the whole, as I see it. We recreational guys do it, being more aware than ever for the need for it. Do you Commercial guys do the same?
Hello, guys;
An interesting discussion - Can I ask you Commercial guys a question?
Before I do tho, I am a recreational fisherman who may be a little biased against the Commercial guys, because of the wrongs I've seen going on in the Bay, guys netting up fish at night, and not even caring if they get fines, because the profits so heavily outweigh them. I have no gripe against legitimate Commercial fishing, and the by-catch issue is unfortunate, and I know the legit fisherman and regulators are doing everything possible to battle it.
I would just like to ask that if you Commercial Fisherman see, or know of, a fellow Fisherman is performing illegal activities, do you report him or advise him to refrain from this, as we Recreational Fisherman do? Speaking for myself, I believe we need to watch over our sport and promply report any outright illegal activity amongst our recreational peers. I am wondering how the Commercial brethren address this problem amongst themselves. I have never heard of one Commercial Fisherman "ratting" another one out, as it were, and I ask this not to be critical - just curious as to how this is addressed. It is a matter of regulating each other for the good of the whole, as I see it. We recreational guys do it, being more aware than ever for the need for it. Do you Commercial guys do the same?
An interesting discussion - Can I ask you Commercial guys a question?
Before I do tho, I am a recreational fisherman who may be a little biased against the Commercial guys, because of the wrongs I've seen going on in the Bay, guys netting up fish at night, and not even caring if they get fines, because the profits so heavily outweigh them. I have no gripe against legitimate Commercial fishing, and the by-catch issue is unfortunate, and I know the legit fisherman and regulators are doing everything possible to battle it.
I would just like to ask that if you Commercial Fisherman see, or know of, a fellow Fisherman is performing illegal activities, do you report him or advise him to refrain from this, as we Recreational Fisherman do? Speaking for myself, I believe we need to watch over our sport and promply report any outright illegal activity amongst our recreational peers. I am wondering how the Commercial brethren address this problem amongst themselves. I have never heard of one Commercial Fisherman "ratting" another one out, as it were, and I ask this not to be critical - just curious as to how this is addressed. It is a matter of regulating each other for the good of the whole, as I see it. We recreational guys do it, being more aware than ever for the need for it. Do you Commercial guys do the same?
I have no objections to commercial fishing, just some of the methods used. It serves a necessary market and we as recreational anglers need to thank you each time we go to the bait shop. However, I commercial fished for a number of years and I know all too well the damage that it can inflict on a resource. I have seen entire grounds completely picked clean of snapper and grouper--And I mean CLEAN. I have seen blue marlin over 800 pounds sink to the bottom dead (not to mention 100's and 100's of other dead billfish), sharks finned and tossed, sea turtles with hooks through their brains. I have seen fish traps bursting at the seams with parrotfish, angelfish and other tropical fish. This is all real and I have seen it with my own eyes. Let's not forget to talk about how commercial overharvesting has affected the recreational limits--Fluke, codfish, winter flounder, weakfish. Where's all the whiting? Look what happened to the striped bass in the 80's. Fish traps devasted Florida reef fishing in the 80's. As I stated, commercial fishing has it's place, but it's place is not to rid the sea of fish.
Gamakatsu
Gamakatsu
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2,911 Posts
Great thread!!
This is good!!.....Commercial guys and Recreational guys actually talking to each other peacfully.
i know that this does actually happen but I still think it's good. hey commercial guys..................please find a market for Sea Robins will ya!
This is good!!.....Commercial guys and Recreational guys actually talking to each other peacfully.
i know that this does actually happen but I still think it's good. hey commercial guys..................please find a market for Sea Robins will ya!
Mike Tuna: I"m not sure what you're trying to imply but you're the type that never has anything good to say about the commercial guy trying to make a living. Its not about the " BUCK", its about feeding a family based on what you were taught from generations in the past. I would like to see guys like you try to make ends meet without a nice cushy job.........
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1,409 Posts
Tony Soprano also has a family to feed . You said about the past generations , Unfortionatly today we have to worry about the future generations because of what happened in the past . History speaks for it self . The almighty BUCK almost would have almost certainly caused some species to become Extinct ( To destoy completely , no longer existing like DINOSOURS ). I'm not talking about Sea Robins either . I am not attacking you Personably , yes its hard out there . But in case you haven't been around and noticed the changes in the fish stocks in the past 30 years or so , I'll tell you this , thank god for some of these tight restrictions and some recovery . There is always the few where the BUCK comes first and just maybe some of these stories you read about are true . Remeber restictions where are hear to try and stop the horror stories and let the future fisheries recover . My guess is the future will bring tighter restrictions so maybe you should think about that and start looking for that cushy job you metioned , just like I am still looking for .
I'm a recreational fisherman and have seen species after species fished to almost unsustainable numbers by commercial fisherman over the past 40 years. Every species that has been targeted has been decimated. Let me give some examples: Atlantic halibut, haddock, winter flounder, striped bass and now cod. Even some non-targeted species get decimated by simple bycatch. This is fact not commercial fishermen bashing and I think the facts speak for themselves. I hate to see people loose jobs but you can't make jobs where there really shouldn't be any.
Just my opinion
Just my opinion
Here's my beef...
Why can't I put out a few lobster pots in Smithtown bay, using my current Non-Commercial lobster license, without some commercial lobsterman cutting my pots or stealing my traps?
I truly don't judge anyone without a good reason. But what am I to think of the greedy lobsterman who thinks he owns the whole Sound???
I've had this discussion with other lobstermen in the area and they agree that there is some display of greed from their peers on a regular basis.
Why can't I put out a few lobster pots in Smithtown bay, using my current Non-Commercial lobster license, without some commercial lobsterman cutting my pots or stealing my traps?
I truly don't judge anyone without a good reason. But what am I to think of the greedy lobsterman who thinks he owns the whole Sound???
I've had this discussion with other lobstermen in the area and they agree that there is some display of greed from their peers on a regular basis.
Wow....I remember a friend who worked on a lobster boat, about 15 years ago, he used to bring a big sack of short lobster claws and tails to sell for 20 bucks a dozen. They worked under the Verrazanno. If they saw a DEC boat coming, they would simply dump the load. He said about all the boats did the same. And I'm talkin' 15 years ago!. With the increased pressure to bring back a profit nowadays, it's scary to think what the percentage might be now......the way I see it, even if every commercial fisherman followed the letter of the law, us recreational fisherman are still getting ripped off........to think a vast majority are undermining the law (and there is no proof to say it isnt possible).....well, it would explain the demise of so many of our species. I'm not saying this is true, I have no proof...but wow, the evidence points this way!
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