[Vector]

One way ! 1 gallon every 700 feet.
A train locomotive uses about 270,000 gallons of fuel a year !

Jet travel is not going to last too long. Unless they find another fuel, in 20 years we'll be going down to Florida on trains.

But its amazing, the price of fuel has tripled since 2001 but airfares haven't. I paid about $75 to fly to Florida in 2001 and the airfares today are like $85 - $100.

And back in the late 90's the price of oil was as low as $13 a barrel but you payed about $1.00 a gallon at the pump. Now oil cost $103 a barrel and gas sells for $3.25 a gallon. Who do you blame for the high gas prices ? Clinton or Bush ? I think the oil companies were gouging us more during the Clinton years.

 

[Jaiem]

If we went back to sail boats and horse&buggy these problems would be solved.

 

[jpd]

From Wikipedia

Hard to confirm, but I see no reason to disbelieve the italics. Remember it the next time a Hollywood moron with a private jet asks you to buy a Prius.

Concorde traveled, per passenger, 17 miles (27 km) for each gallon of fuel (mpg) (or 20 l/100km). This efficiency is comparable to a Gulfstream G550 business jet (~16 mpg or 18 l/100 km per passenger), but much lower than a Boeing 747-400 (~91 mpg or 3.1 l/100 km per passenger)

 

[farside]

The Boeing 747-400ER, the extened range plane, has a max fuel capacity of 63,705 gallons.

So what you're saying is that this plane can't make it to Japan without refueling somewhere over the ocean because it needs 80K gallons to go one way

 

[MisterX]

Vector wrote:
But its amazing, the price of fuel has tripled since 2001 but airfares haven't. I paid about $75 to fly to Florida in 2001 and the airfares today are like $85 - $100.

Now you know why Aitlines are constantly losing money. Pretty soon there are only going to be a few airline COs. They will all have to merge to survive!

BTW, Virgin Atlantic just flew the first flight using Biofuels. It went well

 

[FredyFluke]

farside wrote:
The Boeing 747-400ER, the extened range plane, has a max fuel capacity of 63,705 gallons.

So what you're saying is that this plane can't make it to Japan without refueling somewhere over the ocean because it needs 80K gallons to go one way




range depends on loaded weight. If they are heavy with passengers and cargo they will need to stop for fuel.
NY to Japan flies over the pole, and they normally stop in Anchorage, AK to fuel.

 

[wildcard]

Oil turbine

Used to work at the power plant, and had gas turbines that would run on #2 heating fuel or natural gas. Running #2 heating oil it would burn 275 gallons a minute. I can't remember the cubic feet in natural gas.

Turn your lights off.

 

[fish4me]

All airlines take options to buy fuel far into the future at set prices, a practice known as hedging.

Airlines have long taken steps to guard against spikes in fuel prices, usually buying options to acquire fuel at set prices.

They also carry freight on the plane. It's not all luggage.

 

[Dugan]

Airlines don't stop in Alaska anymore on their way to Japan and haven't for awhile.

I was stationed in Okinawa for four years while in the Air Force from 85-89 and the first two years I had to stop in Alaska to and from. My last two years I did not have to.

Went back a couple of times after '89 and the flights are non-stop from NY to Japan.

 

[FredyFluke]

Dugan wrote:
Airlines don't stop in Alaska anymore on their way to Japan and haven't for awhile.

I was stationed in Okinawa for four years while in the Air Force from 85-89 and the first two years I had to stop in Alaska to and from. My last two years I did not have to.

Went back a couple of times after '89 and the flights are non-stop from NY to Japan.

If they are flying heavy you better believe they are stopping in ANK.

 

[Roccus7]

Very, very rare for ANK fuel stop...

Planes take on enough fuel to go non-stop with normal to moderately heavy headwinds. The only time you stop for fuel is when the jet stream is really cooking...

And here are the fuel "facts" from the Boeing 747 FAQs

Fuel

The 747-400ER can carry more than 63,500 gallons of fuel (240,370 L), making it possible to fly extremely long routes, such as Los Angeles to Melbourne, Australia.

A 747-400 that flies 3,500 statute miles (5,630 km) and carries 126,000 pounds (56,700 kg) of fuel will consume an average of five gallons (19 L) per mile.

The 747-400 carries 3,300 gallons (12,490 L) of fuel in the horizontal (tail) stabilizer, allowing it to fly an additional 350 nautical miles.

This post edited by Roccus7 10:56 AM 03/03/2008

 

[FredyFluke]

Passenger and Combi's perhaps...
Most freighter a/c have to stop in ANK to do Asia/East Coast.

 

[MakoMike]

FredyFluke wrote:
farside wrote:
The Boeing 747-400ER, the extened range plane, has a max fuel capacity of 63,705 gallons.

So what you're saying is that this plane can't make it to Japan without refueling somewhere over the ocean because it needs 80K gallons to go one way




range depends on loaded weight. If they are heavy with passengers and cargo they will need to stop for fuel.
NY to Japan flies over the pole, and they normally stop in Anchorage, AK to fuel.


No true, I've flown many times from JFK to Narita non-stop. The airlines haev those non-stop flights scheduled every day. On an "average" load using the polar route there is no need for them to refuel.

 

[FredyFluke]

MakoMike wrote:
FredyFluke wrote:
farside wrote:
The Boeing 747-400ER, the extened range plane, has a max fuel capacity of 63,705 gallons.

So what you're saying is that this plane can't make it to Japan without refueling somewhere over the ocean because it needs 80K gallons to go one way




range depends on loaded weight. If they are heavy with passengers and cargo they will need to stop for fuel.
NY to Japan flies over the pole, and they normally stop in Anchorage, AK to fuel.


No true, I've flown many times from JFK to Narita non-stop. The airlines haev those non-stop flights scheduled every day. On an "average" load using the polar route there is no need for them to refuel.


It is true Mike that many Passenger aircraft fly direct non-stop.
But also true that many of them do stop to re-fuel in ANC.
Especially coming in heavy from Asia.
In a later post I stated "heavy" flights.

Airlines will sacrifice fuel weight for additional cargo capacity.
18 hours of fuel vs. 9 hours is a LOT of weight.
9 hours of fuel translates to extra cargo capacity.
Instead of flying non-stop (18 hours of fuel) they fly 7-9 to ANC, refuel and continue on.
Many of them offload cargo in ANC that moves into AK, and BC.
Below is from an article on the subject in the Alaska Press.

"Now ranked the top cargo handler in North America and third in the world, according to John Torgerson, deputy commissioner of aviation with Alaska?s Department of Transportation, the Anchorage airport is a much larger operation than the one in Prince George. More than 5 million passengers come through Anchorage each year. About 276 aircraft land here every day. Just fewer than half of those are cargo planes, stopping for maintenance and fuel before delivering the goods they?re carrying to Asia or to the Lower 48 for distribution."

 

[farside]

So let's see if I have this right:

A typical 747-400 will burn around 5 gallons per mile, give or take.
A flight to Japan from NY is what, 6800 miles or so?
Using liberal figures, if the NY-Japan flight is 7000 miles and the jet uses 8 gallons per mile, that would equal 56,0000 gallons of fuel. And that's an exagerated number...it'll be more like 34-44 thousand gallons depending on weight, winds, etc.

Does this sound right or am I way off with my math?