Saltwater Fishing Discussion Board Including Inshore Fishing, Offshore Fishing, Saltwater Fly Fishing and Kayak Fishing

Huntndfsh,
The CG officer said they go by the length on the registration, which on my buddy's Parker, said 21'. Now what we need is someone to inform the Coasties that less then 21' does NOT INCLUDE a 21' boat! And also, that at anchor and fishing, is not different then just at anchor, which is what he was saying. Believe me I was dumbfounded, but did not say anything further, as it was not my boat, and the coasties were being very pleasant about the whole thing.

Huntington Angler's Club

Hunt n' Fish
Noreast.com Club Member

Moderator
Boating Angler
General Fishing Forum
Posted Reports
Hunting

Joined: 04/11/2001
Posts: 7853
Location: Holbrook, NY

posted 11/03/2009 01:10 AM

chawk wrote:
The CG officer said they go by the length on the registration,

Like I said, it's open to interpretation. That is how the CG may interpret it, but that's not what the regulation says. The reg doesn't clearly define what the length is measured by. And it's not a federal reg, so the CG most likely wouldn't have the interpreative guidance to determine the "intent" on it either. Therefore, you may very well win in court in front of a judge if you wanted to argue it.

President, RAIBS
Recreational Anglers against Internet BS

chawk

Joined: 04/15/2005
Posts: 476
Location: Huntington

posted 11/03/2009 07:19 AM

HuntNfsh,
Been meaning to ask you this for a long time but keep forgetting....

Were you trying to teach the lab to be afraid of gators?(lol) Which would be a great thing if you ever take him/her to Florida. I take my springer there and always have him on a tight leash near any water (fresh/brackish)! One of my mom's friends there lost a dog to a gator.
Bill

Huntington Angler's Club

This post edited by chawk 07:19 AM 11/03/2009

Hunt n' Fish
Noreast.com Club Member

Moderator
Boating Angler
General Fishing Forum
Posted Reports
Hunting

Joined: 04/11/2001
Posts: 7853
Location: Holbrook, NY

posted 11/03/2009 07:35 AM

Not my dog. Just a funny .gif I was sent. I wish I had thought of it with my pointer. My lab would give a **** about something like that tied to him.

President, RAIBS
Recreational Anglers against Internet BS

fishforlife
Noreast.com Club Member

Joined: 07/21/2003
Posts: 161

posted 11/03/2009 10:14 AM

at anchor

chawk wrote:
Huntndfsh,
The CG officer said they go by the length on the registration, which on my buddy's Parker, said 21'. Now what we need is someone to inform the Coasties that less then 21' does NOT INCLUDE a 21' boat! And also, that at anchor and fishing, is not different then just at anchor, which is what he was saying. Believe me I was dumbfounded, but did not say anything further, as it was not my boat, and the coasties were being very pleasant about the whole thing.

I read that law the same way as you, at anchor the jackets dont have to be on, I dont know if it is written somewhere that it is at anchorage in a safe haven, anchorage area, I didnt see it as such.We need further clarification.

JohnnyKapalua

Joined: 09/14/2004
Posts: 518

posted 11/03/2009 03:50 PM

About adding length to a boat to make it 21 or more.

Just got info from DMV & NYS Parks & Rec. on boat lengths. This has to do with the 21' issue. No it's not about 21 or more or less than 21. It addresses a pulpit add on or swim deck to lengthen boat from almost 21 to over 21. Like a 20 + 1 or 2 = 21/22.

I brought that up on the thread and decided to follow up to verify if it could be done. It can't.

This is the request I sent to DMV;

I am considering a project whereby I will install a "pulpit" to the bow of my boat which will extend the overall length of the boat by at least 1-2 feet. The purpose of installation is for anchoring and being able to set two anchor lines for fishing and the retrieval of same. When I re-register the boat next season am I required to make a note of this in section 6 of DMV 82b increasing the over all boat length now measured from the front of the pulpit to the transom by the 1-2 additional feet?
Further, would this also apply should I install a swim platform on the transom?

The response from DMV;

I am going to suggest you contact Parks and Recreation directly at area code (518-474-0445 with your questions.

Nov. 3rd I spoke with a rep. at the number listed. I was transferred to a person that deals with this. I repeated the previous info. I also made mention of several scenarios, i.e. a Steiger, Sea Ray built with a bow pulpit or extention, or swim platform installed at the factory. I've seen them and they are all installed as bolt on sections. The following was explained to me;

If the boat was made with a "molded in" type pulpit and is actually part of the original construction of the hull the measurement would be from the tip to stern.
An add on pulpit (bow platform) or swim platform does not get included on the DMV overall length of a boat. Not even if it was an "add on" from the factory. It has to be a permanent part of the actual hull. They only use the length of the actual boat from bow to stern. You can not add a foot or two to length by adding an extension.

That puts my idea to add one on to a 20 out the window. At least I know now.
New more comfortable PFD's are in the mail.
Shades

Squeri Boy

Joined: 02/21/2002
Posts: 691
Location: Emories Basin, LI

posted 11/03/2009 11:00 PM

FYI

The intention of this law was not a money grab. This billl originated in Parks & Rec. They would get no money from tickets. They originally wanted this bill to cover labor day to Memorial Day. The marine industry opposed this bill because of the dates and would not support it with the holiday dates! We also oppose lifejacket wear all year long and will fight it in Albany if introduced.

If you look at the fatalities every year, about 50% of these fatalities are on small craft/vessel. In 2008, there were 21 fatalities. Of those 21 fatalities, 10 were on small craft/vessels. And 8 occurred between October and May.

My concern is that several of these deaths occurred on non-registered vessels such as canoes, kayaks and rowboats. If they are not registered, how can we notify these people that its needed?

All these numbers can be found at the NYS Parks website.

Pro Staff - Chaos, Gamakatsu, SPRO, Pelagic, Canyon Runner

This post edited by Squeri Boy 01:23 AM 11/04/2009

chawk

Joined: 04/15/2005
Posts: 476
Location: Huntington

posted 11/04/2009 12:55 AM

JohnnyK, I found that same info as you in regards to Regis. but try telling that to the Town Marinas in some towns. My buddy added a homemade wood pulpit after seeing mine. That same season, got a letter in the mail from his town (marina) that they were increasing his fee (60/ft) the added LOA. He sent them a letter back that he was taking it OFF! (he said something like, stick it! lol) They are just money hungry. Weren't changing his slip or anything either.

Huntington Angler's Club

JohnnyKapalua

Joined: 09/14/2004
Posts: 518

posted 11/04/2009 07:14 AM

CHawk EXACTLY. I mentioned that to the fellow I spoke with and he knew it and agreed it's wrong but that's what the Marina Industry has been doing all along and they have no control over that issue. Some world. Roll

tomjg

Joined: 11/14/2006
Posts: 2587
Location: long beach

posted 11/04/2009 09:51 AM

Squeri Boy wrote:
FYI

The intention of this law was not a money grab. This billl originated in Parks & Rec. They would get no money from tickets. They originally wanted this bill to cover labor day to Memorial Day. The marine industry opposed this bill because of the dates and would not support it with the holiday dates! We also oppose lifejacket wear all year long and will fight it in Albany if introduced.

If you look at the fatalities every year, about 50% of these fatalities are on small craft/vessel. In 2008, there were 21 fatalities. Of those 21 fatalities, 10 were on small craft/vessels. And 8 occurred between October and May.

My concern is that several of these deaths occurred on non-registered vessels such as canoes, kayaks and rowboats. If they are not registered, how can we notify these people that its needed?

All these numbers can be found at the NYS Parks website.

If it's not about the money it is still wrong IMO.
As I stated in a previous post- if we start passing laws to (maybe) save 10 people from unnecessary deaths, we are on a very slippery slope.
Passing laws that effect the masses for the sake of .0000001% isn't the answer. You can't pass a common sense bill. To use the argument that we need a law to (maybe) save 10 people a year would open the door to a host of "common sense" laws. What would be next?
A law stating that no one can go outside in a thunder storm? Hell- someone dies every year by lightning - maybe we should fine anyone outside during a thunderstorm?
I know that's an extreme example - but I think you get my drift?
If you can't swim- wear a PDF. If you are alone in a boat in snotty conditions- wear a PDF- etc. etc. If you choose to not wear one in conditions that call for them and you perish- that is truly sad but we can't make a law for every little thing that could result in death.
I didn't see a stat by the way- of those 10 fatalities- were some of them wearing life vests anyway?

AMERICA- YOU'VE BEEN DUPED!!

This post edited by tomjg 11:45 AM 11/04/2009

WESTERNS0UND

Joined: 10/23/2009
Posts: 99

posted 11/04/2009 10:11 AM

If i move the boat into my companies name, can i register it as commercial. (business name does have fishing in the title) This would work for my car, but not sure about the boat.

This post edited by WESTERNS0UND 10:25 AM 11/04/2009

nichefish

Joined: 06/06/2008
Posts: 71

posted 11/04/2009 11:19 AM

WESTERNS0UND wrote:
If i move the boat into my companies name, can i register it as commercial. (business name does have fishing in the title) This would work for my car, but not sure about the boat.

It probably wouldn't matter for this regulation unless you could also show that you were actually operating the boat for hire or fishing commercially (with the proper licenses).

synthnut

Joined: 09/11/2009
Posts: 4

posted 11/05/2009 06:52 PM

The government could care less about your life .....PFD's are a good idea IF you want to wear one ....The government mandates that you HAVE to wear one in boats 21 and under in these months ...Why you ask ? ..They can now patrol and they KNOW that there will be a lot of folks not wearing them , just like folks not wearing seat belts ....IT'S MORE REVENUE generated crap , not to mention , they can now put another one of their friends to work in the newly formed Dept. of Floatation Devices ......Watch and see if they don't come up with something like that !!!....It's all what I call Legalized Corruption !!!..... We continue to fund a government that doesn't know how to properly run a business, and continues to loose OUR MONEY !! ...They only know how to take care of themselves and the lobby groups that put them and keep them in office ..... Jim

PS ....They have raised the prices on everything since NY is BROKE !!!.....So I just register less vehicles than I did last year ....I put one boat in the water instead of two ....I put 1 motorcycle on the road instead of 2 ..... They will now get less money from me than they did last year for their greed !!....

nichefish

Joined: 06/06/2008
Posts: 71

posted 11/08/2009 08:04 PM

Today I watched the Rye police motor up to an anchored jonboat near Parsonage Point. Within 30 seconds the 3 men on the jonboat put on their PFDs. I was too far away to tell if any summons were written but they were there for a few minutes and it looked like they inspected the rest of the safety equipment on the boat.

FishFooler

Joined: 02/19/2008
Posts: 107
Location: Merrimack River

posted 11/09/2009 02:02 PM

Gov't messing with the natural order!

This law is bad for the gene pool. Those that drown because they were too stupid or too stubborn to wear a PFD in the winter months wouldn't be passing those traits on to the next generation!