Saltwater Fishing Discussion Board Including Inshore Fishing, Offshore Fishing, Saltwater Fly Fishing and Kayak Fishing

Alot of the hooks used by fisherman that gut hook fish are not true cirle hooks like the gami octupus circle.easy baiters ec....
Hook makers have shorten the hook nail and widened the gap and off set the barb to accomodate big baits like chunks.
And this causes gut hooked fished and lost fish from the hook not locking and encircling the fishs jaw completely.
True circle hooks have a large nail and narrow gap between the shank and the barb they are engineered to skip along the fishs inner mouth and lock on to the outer jaw bone 99% of the time with just the motion of the fish swiming away with the bait..

(This post edited by togmaster on 09/04/2003)

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HungryJack

Joined: 06/10/2002
Posts: 6921
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posted 09/04/2003 12:13 PM

Thanks Sam

You saved me some typing.
You are very correct in your statements !

The gami octopus circle hook SUCKS,
plain and simple,
a non performing hook.

I like their regular octopus hooks a lot.

quiknet
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Location: north bellmore

posted 09/04/2003 12:54 PM

Togmaster,
Did you mean the mustad 92553BL? I couldn't find a 92533BL in my catalogs. If you were talking about the former hook, do you find them pretty sharp out of the box or do they need to be sharpened?
-Beware the silver menace-

(This post edited by quiknet on 09/04/2003)

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togmaster
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posted 09/04/2003 01:42 PM

Sorry

Yes quicknet ihad a senior moment no they need to be sharpened out of the box just a slight pass on each side and the center works fine for me. They have better tensil strenght then gama's.
Jack and Sam I must a gree the gama circles suck. Let me know a better hook and i'll give it a try. By the way there octupus hooks also bend under heavy pressure? Had 3 of them open up on me this year

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leakyrivot

Joined: 08/23/2002
Posts: 4080
Location: Newton, NH

posted 09/04/2003 04:00 PM

chunking

This confuses me reading through all this info on chunking. Some of you guys definitly seem to know what you are doing, I don't doubt that, just a big contradiction to my experience and what others have taught me.

Honestly.. I used to chunk alot on anchor, we caught hundreds and hundreds of small fish doing it with only a few fish over 10 lbs here and there!

At some point I started hooking up with some more experienced anglers that fished the area (mostly the merrimack river in salisbury/newburyport ma). These guys taught me quite a bit, and the consensus was definitly - rule #1 - don't chunk, it's for amatures. Fish live baits, eels at night, or whole baits, that's if you want to catch decent bass. Allways drift, unless of course the winds are up in the 20's or you are trying to fish a very difficult area (rocks all around etc..). I'm not kidding either - the term "chunker" or "chunking anchor fleet" are both used in a derogatory way.

I'm not saying I totally agree with any of that.. I honeslty don't know it's just the message I get.. I've seen nice fish come in on a chunk, ie some guy fishing out of a speed-boat with a surf-rod.. just the guys that consistently get the really nice fish (not saying that's me either Wink

) all seem to be live-lining something.

From my personal experience too, the second I switched to whole baits, it made a big difference in the class of fish I was boating. Now, please, don't get me wrong - like I said, seems you all know what you are talking about and if it works, it works.. just it's a big contradiction. Mabye something to do with the area.

Jon

"Kids, don't try this at home."

bigdog1001

Joined: 06/16/2002
Posts: 439
Location: Stamford

posted 09/04/2003 06:06 PM

Live is FresH

Rivot, live lining works great if you have live bait available. Obviously it is fresher and the maxim of Big Bait for Big Fish is at least partly accurate. Can you get live shad/porgies/bunker easily and often? If not, then a good bunker chunk will pull fish and lots of quality fish. This season, I put the fly rod down for the summer doldrums (Norwalk Islands is my home turf) and worked the chunk very successfully for 42+ inch bass and 15lb Blues without more than a little commons sense about tide/structure. If a newbie like me can make it work, anybody can! Would I live line, sure a snagged bunker or caught shad or porgy would be great. So it is not either/or, its making what you got work!

Maybe others can shed some light on Eels (live or rigged) vs. Bunker Chunks. I have never fished an eel (other than a fly pattern!). Tight lines to all.

togmaster
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posted 09/04/2003 06:40 PM

On track?

Guys the topic was not to compare the bait you use to each other rather just enlight you on how to chunk No one was saying a live bait is worse or better then a dead one. Myself a live bunker or herring is king of the crop but thats not Chunking thats what we call dunkn Smile

So the topic here is just about how to chunk with dead baits. Live bait is better when drifting like you stated so don't confuse your self your on track just take the post for what it is intended for Smile

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leakyrivot

Joined: 08/23/2002
Posts: 4080
Location: Newton, NH

posted 09/05/2003 01:27 PM

Tog -

I'm really asking a question up there, trying to figure out why so much conflicting info between experienced anglers.

Would it be safe to say that it works well when other baits are not available? Although not allways easy to come across later in the season, there is just about allways some bait around.. is that the issue with chunking?

Jon

"Kids, don't try this at home."

ErikT

Joined: 11/06/2001
Posts: 24

posted 09/05/2003 01:57 PM

I wrote this up 2 years ago..

The Art of Throwing “Da Chunk!

THE SNAG

First there has to be bait present to even consider snagging. Use a treble hook and cast it as far as you can into the breaking bunker. Either snag right away or if they are sporadic, let it sink a little to get some that may be hanging on the bottom. (Just because there’s no mayhem doesn’t mean they aren’t there) 1, 2, sweep. 1, 2, sweep BANG! You just snagged your first bunker. Wow you say, this feels like a bass. I explain that a 1 pound baitfish coming in sideways isn’t easy. Get as many Bunker as you think you need and then add at least 5. There will be some nights where you’ll be glad you brought extra. Wink

OK, now we have Bait. We’re chunking, so live-lining these critters isn’t an option. If it’s daylight I’ll usually retreat to my house for a meal and then get setup for that night.

THE SETUP

I quickly do a check of your setups and decide that the 3-way swivel must go. Yeah, it’ll sometimes catch fish but there are better rigs. We will be using the fish-finder rig. We’ll first spool up with a decent strength mono, today it will be 25 pound Ande. Main line through the fish-finder tied directly to a swivel. 60 pound leader will be our choice in this situation snelled to a Gamagatsu 8\0 Octopus Circlehook. Now we are setup.

THE CHUNKS

Here’s where you may want to branch out on your own, everyone has their favorite choice meat when it comes to chunking. Today, we will be throwing the “Sweet” (a term coined by the great chunker KDOGG). First we cut off the tail at the very tip. Now we cut again about 2 inches up the fish and we have our chunk. I personally don’t like the middle because once the stomach is gone, there’s a big empty hole that doesn’t look to appetizing to me. Again, others may love these pieces, but we throw the sweet and fresh bloody heads.

THE HOOK PLACEMENT

This is Extremely important for Chunking BASS. Remember, a Bass will not bite into the chunk like a bluefish, he will put it in his mouth and possibly down his stomach. You want an EXPOSED HOOK when chunking Bass. I go about a 1\4 – 1\2 an inch below the back of the bunker and right out the other side of the back. Basically, the Chunk is hanging off of the hook by the bend. This allows instant hook-sets and limits the amount of missed opportunities. When blue-fishing with chunks, bury the hook. They will bite the chunk right down the middle and right into the hook. Ever been chunking for bass and a blue hits the bait? Usually miss the fish and the chunk comes back with a big bite mark in it.

THE DRAG

Here’s where I will get some flack. I personally like a nice tight drag when chunking for Bass w\ circle hooks. This usually provides instant hook-ups with less missed fish. Mono helps in this situation because it has enough stretch that the fish runs a little before he feels the resistance. Also a nice glass rod will help to lessen the resistance a fish will feel. Many great fishermen allow their drag to be in free spool and use the clicker. This let’s the Bass pickup the bait and run like a freight train until he’s abruptly stopped by the set of your hook. Sounds great, but I’ve seen too many fish scream the drag and then when they get there, it’s gone. Again, this is my opinion and it is based on personal experience and the experiences of others.

THE CATCH

With the tight drag, I’ll see my pole start to bounce or remain in a steady bend. I drop the rod tip down and slowly lean into the fish, not yanking the circle out of her mouth. Drag is up to you, the fish and the current. I’ve had 12 pound Bass scream the drag and fight like a 25 pound fish solely because he was in the rip. This is where your fishing skills take over, catching can only be learned by doing exactly that.

THE END

Well that’s it, I know there are many other methods for chunking, but this is the way I do it I have no complaints. I know others will chime in with their criticisms but that’s OK with me. Whatever works for you is great.

ErikT

Circle Hooks Rule

MakoMatt
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posted 09/05/2003 02:13 PM

Leaky, Bunker chunking is just another way to fish for Bass. Given the choice between live Bunker/fish, or fresh chunks, I’d take a live fish. Bunker chunking serves a purpose, i.e., for me, I don’t have a live well, I often have no time to search for bait other then the bait store on the way out, and it works.

As far as circle hooks are concerned, I don’t have much personal experience with them, and after reading the posts, I think I’ll keep it that way, just make sure whatever hook you use is sized correctly, strong, and sharp.

MakoMatt

(This post edited by MakoMatt on 09/05/2003)

togmaster
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posted 09/05/2003 02:14 PM

Chunk Vs. live bait

Leaky I don't think you chunk because live baitis not available or at least not my reason The reason I chunk is when fish are held to a structure or rip or area it is sometime more productive to anchor up and build them behind the boat. There are time when chunking will out perform live bait in this case and vice versea. Hey this season most of the bass I landed started out on live bait but the blues come by bite the body off and the bass come in and hit the head. This is a perfect example of live verse dead. One thing is thebait should always try and be as fresh as possible. There are places out east where we actually like frozen chunks better also. So there are many diffrent ways touse live and dead baits effectivly. Try them all till you find what is working best inthe area you plan to fish

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SurfPounder

Joined: 03/16/2003
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posted 09/05/2003 10:44 PM

Guy next to me was live lining bunker had three bass.I was using heads ,was already on my tenth bass.Bass are expert scavengers.They would take a head over a live bunker any day.Bunkers are very fast fish and give bass hell to be caught ,even when there injured.A bass would much rather suck up freshley chopped heads on the bottom.

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quiknet
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posted 09/08/2003 08:35 PM

How about chum?

Do any of you experienced chunkers use frozen bunker chum to set up a slick?

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Leprechaun
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posted 09/08/2003 11:41 PM

My $0.02 0n hooks

I see no mention of my favorite hook - the Gami Baitholder in 5/0 or 6/0.

Maybe a little small for the big chunks, but with its rounder bend (Than an Eagle Claw for example) and SLIGHTLY turned in point its really a good "Hook-set ratio" piece and is my go-to hook up in the Bay.

I've found that you can catch 20 fish on one of these hooks without incident, BUT if you twist it slightly with your pliers, you are on borrowed time - the hook will eventually fail. Just keep the pliers off it and it is a real hook-up machine.

Octopus hooks - nice pieces and well-regarded, but I've found a new favorite bass hook. Expensive, but NO hook I've ever used seems stronger or stays hooked up like this one.

What is it?

The Owner "Aki" hook.

Originally designed as a Tarpon fly hook it is just an unbelieveably strong piece with a near-perfect hookup and "Stay-stuck" ratio.

Hard piece to find - I get mine at ProFishing in Flushing and now my homie Mark Flynn is ordering them for me 6 packs at a time. (Only becasue I can afford just 6 packs of them at any one time). Plus he showed me his catalog and I see that they also offer a version with an offset "Kirbied" point - so I'm a-gonna try that this Fall as well.

Very expensive at almost a Buck apiece - but if you give them a try, you too will be impressed.

Oh - and you won't need a sharping stone with these things. They make a Gami look dull by comparison.

Give 'em a shot.

rgds, Leprechaun

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iriesue

Joined: 08/13/2001
Posts: 82

posted 09/09/2003 05:57 AM

Shallow Water & other comments

Chunking in shallow water is very productive in the warm water months like July & August. I fish in the Western Long Island Sound, and I find that quality stripers can be taken in extremely shallow water. The Sound has very steep dropoffs, but the Stripers seem very comfortable coming into the shallows near rocky beaches and structures like pilings on an incoming tide after sunset when the water is warm. I have had success chunking 40" fish in 3 to 4 feet of water up against a shoreline. I have done well near mussel laiden pilings on the July full moon on the incoming up to high tide after dark. I have had nonstop action on bunker chunks and bunker heads in less than 10'.

I also use two rods from my boat. I use a Shimano Baitrunner 6500. The secondary drag system is completely controllable as opposed to using the cliker on a conventional reel. I use a conventional reel with the cliker on for the other, and see what works. I use fishfinder rig setups or egg sinkers using braided line with 50-60lb test leaders.

You need braided line to avoid getting cutoff by the mussel beds, pilings and rocks.

Strped Bass eat EVERYTHING!